well its been a few more days of gear crunching to set up this clutch operation pedal so smooth gear changes can be encountered once more
a new gen cit cable has been fitted but the standard nut and bolt adjustment was not enough, I had to place 1/4 washers within to give a smooth change
I have checked the link rods for size and are all bang on with haynes
the only thing that bugs me is when I stripped the linkage and link rods for clutch swap I removed a great deal off crap and sticky stuff off the swivel ball socket linkage, is there suposed to be a plastic or rubber bush inside or is it just steel to steel and it was just 150,000 miles of road collected crud and service grease ?
it only happens now in fifth gear and it has to be a controlled and positive change to be smooth (and a slight pause)
any common faults on this linkage that I should know ??
car is still the same as old clutch with regards the pedal been up higher than the brake pedal to work
HELPPPPPPP
CU
RADAR
message for anders dk yes ( M.a.s.h - old jobs die but knicknames stick )
Zx 1.9 d clutch help info continued
Moderator: RichardW
OK radar - [:)]
Seriously : I've also noticed this sort of crap on my Cit species, looking like dissolved plastic or whatever. It does in fact looks like a nylon cap or so. But I managed to remove it with petrol & then it simply must be dried out heavy grease. There are special purpose grease around for high-temp use, and these usually turns like hard wax, when dry.
It turns out that on some cars there is in fact a nylon cup inside the clutch release arm, where it resides on the ball. This is of course outmost important to the clutch cable adjustment range.
If Haynes is no-no on this (likely), some of the wise guys on ZX may come up with answers.
If you STILL experience problems changing gears, you also still have a problem in the clutch - it's that simple.
Unless of course - the box is heavy worn in the syncros.
This seems unlikely yet at 150K.
Sure the box runs on prescribed TYPE of gear-oil (brand indifferent), and correct oil level [?]
Check Haynes for correct pedal travel - this is important.
The travel is the pedal distance from rest to bottom carpet touch. This is to some drivers a somewhat uncomfortable long travel, may be you have adopted this a bit tight [?]
Have you indeed checked the pedal box for any signs of weakness [?]
Have an assistent calmly working the pedal while you look everything (!!) over. This worked for me on a BX, with a seized linkarm bushing.
Seriously : I've also noticed this sort of crap on my Cit species, looking like dissolved plastic or whatever. It does in fact looks like a nylon cap or so. But I managed to remove it with petrol & then it simply must be dried out heavy grease. There are special purpose grease around for high-temp use, and these usually turns like hard wax, when dry.
It turns out that on some cars there is in fact a nylon cup inside the clutch release arm, where it resides on the ball. This is of course outmost important to the clutch cable adjustment range.
If Haynes is no-no on this (likely), some of the wise guys on ZX may come up with answers.
If you STILL experience problems changing gears, you also still have a problem in the clutch - it's that simple.
Unless of course - the box is heavy worn in the syncros.
This seems unlikely yet at 150K.
Sure the box runs on prescribed TYPE of gear-oil (brand indifferent), and correct oil level [?]
Check Haynes for correct pedal travel - this is important.
The travel is the pedal distance from rest to bottom carpet touch. This is to some drivers a somewhat uncomfortable long travel, may be you have adopted this a bit tight [?]
Have you indeed checked the pedal box for any signs of weakness [?]
Have an assistent calmly working the pedal while you look everything (!!) over. This worked for me on a BX, with a seized linkarm bushing.
-
Dave Burns
- Posts: 1915
- Joined: 14 May 2001, 05:30
- Location: United Kingdom
- My Cars:
- x 2
What does it go into reverse like, there's no syncro on reverse so any problem with the clutch not dissengaging fully will be self evident as the gears will crunch, if it slots into reverse with no crunching then the clutch is freeing correctly.
New clutch, new cable and having to use washers because the adjustment thread is all used up suggest something is radicaly wrong to me, perhaps something bent, incorreclty installed or even missing.
Dave
New clutch, new cable and having to use washers because the adjustment thread is all used up suggest something is radicaly wrong to me, perhaps something bent, incorreclty installed or even missing.
Dave
Hi all,
goes into reverse fine, no crunching
gearbox oil replaced with clutch swap to a semi syth as prevoiusly used at 100,000 miles change (with no problems) made by comma
its a very long pedal and its got to be depressed right down to the floor to gear change, no slick shifting here
cannot see any obvious bending siezure or sticking links or bushes, pedal action is light ish and smooth
the plastic bushes in the box where checked and relubed on clutch swap action of release bearing on shaft ok and lightly lubed
I am at a loss, but no way am I taking it to a dealer or garage for repair to get my eyes ripped out no way
Cit dealer wanted £400 to change clutch and another 40 quid to fit cable and I bet they are geniune parts too, motor factors are there every day for there fast fit centre
together we will crack it someday
I do no that my next Cit will be an auto... too much clutch hassle (ex BX er)
CU
RADAR
goes into reverse fine, no crunching
gearbox oil replaced with clutch swap to a semi syth as prevoiusly used at 100,000 miles change (with no problems) made by comma
its a very long pedal and its got to be depressed right down to the floor to gear change, no slick shifting here
cannot see any obvious bending siezure or sticking links or bushes, pedal action is light ish and smooth
the plastic bushes in the box where checked and relubed on clutch swap action of release bearing on shaft ok and lightly lubed
I am at a loss, but no way am I taking it to a dealer or garage for repair to get my eyes ripped out no way
Cit dealer wanted £400 to change clutch and another 40 quid to fit cable and I bet they are geniune parts too, motor factors are there every day for there fast fit centre
together we will crack it someday
I do no that my next Cit will be an auto... too much clutch hassle (ex BX er)
CU
RADAR
radar -
It does'nt seem we're getting anywhere on your problem.
Everything seems ok to your descriptions.
There's one thing though that bothers's me :
From my 28 y's of DIY car experience, it's been a fact, that using ANY other TYPE of lubrications than prescribed by the manufacturer, allways seems to introduce some kinds of troubles.
This is true on engine oils, the known fact that modern synt oils allways produce more engine noise, and most often also causes oil consumption to the high side. On older engine types that is.
Modern synt oils are on the other hand a known better lubricator, clearly felt as a more lively engine.
It's for sure even worse on boxes (older types), since both syncro's and gears are designed to the thought oil type used.
So especially on boxes, you may see quite adverse effects (other than considerably more noise), using a better (thinner) lubricator.
In general the better lubrication of modern synt oils are ALLWAYS taken as the best quality oil to use on ones car. And oil companies are pushing to this in evreyplace adds.
But it's simply not true.
There's a LOT more to oils, than simply having thinner viscosity and better lubrication.
It's a bit like the wattage on front headlamps :
More wattage gives more light. This is not allways true. It surely also depends on the bulb's technology, the cabling to the bulb, and the optics designed into the lampcluster. We've all tried being blinded by a headlamp not designed for too high intensy bulbs fitted.
Even your headlamp cluster may simply melt down, due to wrong bulbs with too high heat wasting.
My point is :
Things are designed & mated to fit each other for best performance, under the given circumstances. Pull one end, and the whole thing may slip down the road, even using a golden pull handle & wearing a branded Armani suit.
It does'nt seem we're getting anywhere on your problem.
Everything seems ok to your descriptions.
There's one thing though that bothers's me :
From my 28 y's of DIY car experience, it's been a fact, that using ANY other TYPE of lubrications than prescribed by the manufacturer, allways seems to introduce some kinds of troubles.
This is true on engine oils, the known fact that modern synt oils allways produce more engine noise, and most often also causes oil consumption to the high side. On older engine types that is.
Modern synt oils are on the other hand a known better lubricator, clearly felt as a more lively engine.
It's for sure even worse on boxes (older types), since both syncro's and gears are designed to the thought oil type used.
So especially on boxes, you may see quite adverse effects (other than considerably more noise), using a better (thinner) lubricator.
In general the better lubrication of modern synt oils are ALLWAYS taken as the best quality oil to use on ones car. And oil companies are pushing to this in evreyplace adds.
But it's simply not true.
There's a LOT more to oils, than simply having thinner viscosity and better lubrication.
It's a bit like the wattage on front headlamps :
More wattage gives more light. This is not allways true. It surely also depends on the bulb's technology, the cabling to the bulb, and the optics designed into the lampcluster. We've all tried being blinded by a headlamp not designed for too high intensy bulbs fitted.
Even your headlamp cluster may simply melt down, due to wrong bulbs with too high heat wasting.
My point is :
Things are designed & mated to fit each other for best performance, under the given circumstances. Pull one end, and the whole thing may slip down the road, even using a golden pull handle & wearing a branded Armani suit.
Radar,
I was having a similar discussion with someone on a similar problem recently & this oil you speak of is a common denominator.
His problems grew when he gave his a belly full of Comma as well.
There is a guy on the net from Budapest, Gabor Deak Jahn, who is an engineer & has a site relating to DIY on BXs and someone held in high regard as to his knowledge & research. This is an excerpt from his site speaking about gear oils.
"If you have the service records and they show that the transmission oil is not yet near the end of its expected lifetime, you can leave it alone. If you have to change it, buy mineral oil. Synthetics are perfect for the engine but are a bit too thin for the gearbox of the BX, resulting in less smooth a gearchange"
Speaking from personal experience with several BXs I have found that a total oil change using Castrol EMS80 with Nulon G-70 gearbox additive gives absolutely outstanding results. Fast smooth changes & no strange noises. I will not use an engine additive as I consider them in the same league as "Snake oil" but in the transmission most reputable ones seem to work up to their claims if used as per manufacturers recommendations.
Sounds to me as though you've got the rest of it fairly right but your oil could be letting you down. For the price of 2 litres of oil you could be out of the woods....hopefully [:D]
Alan S
I was having a similar discussion with someone on a similar problem recently & this oil you speak of is a common denominator.
His problems grew when he gave his a belly full of Comma as well.
There is a guy on the net from Budapest, Gabor Deak Jahn, who is an engineer & has a site relating to DIY on BXs and someone held in high regard as to his knowledge & research. This is an excerpt from his site speaking about gear oils.
"If you have the service records and they show that the transmission oil is not yet near the end of its expected lifetime, you can leave it alone. If you have to change it, buy mineral oil. Synthetics are perfect for the engine but are a bit too thin for the gearbox of the BX, resulting in less smooth a gearchange"
Speaking from personal experience with several BXs I have found that a total oil change using Castrol EMS80 with Nulon G-70 gearbox additive gives absolutely outstanding results. Fast smooth changes & no strange noises. I will not use an engine additive as I consider them in the same league as "Snake oil" but in the transmission most reputable ones seem to work up to their claims if used as per manufacturers recommendations.
Sounds to me as though you've got the rest of it fairly right but your oil could be letting you down. For the price of 2 litres of oil you could be out of the woods....hopefully [:D]
Alan S