1.9TD Xantia with 2.1 XM bosch pump and injectors?

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Xaccers
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1.9TD Xantia with 2.1 XM bosch pump and injectors?

Post by Xaccers »

Is it possible?
Would it fuel more and give more oomph?

It's just there's a 2.1TD XM at the scrappy with a very clean pump on it, and well, Cassy's is not so clean and a tad moist...
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Post by mark21td »

Not sure if it would fit but I put a 1.9 pump on a 2.1.

A Bosch 2.1 pump and injectors would sell for a good price to anyone wonting to veg up a xantia or 406 2.1, I for one would have paid good money at the time.
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Re: 1.9TD Xantia with 2.1 XM bosch pump and injectors?

Post by deian »

I thought they were the same pump, just tuned differently? Maybe I need to be corrected.

Not even sure if the injectors are different, if they are you are on to a good idea there Xac, unless the holes are different sizes, being smaller on a 1.9 is not too bad, at least you can bore them out to stuff the 2.1 injectors in.
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Post by mark21td »

Have you tuned your 1.9 pump and turbo ?
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Post by MikeT »

There's no need to swap pumps if you want more fuel, Xac but if yours is leaking then it might be worth getting a spare. If you can afford it, I'd advise getting new injector nozzles rather than used ones though.

Is your IP fully mechanical or semi-electronic? Either way, it could be bit down on pressure and that will effect both power and economy but as you probably know, they can be adjusted 8)
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Post by CitroJim »

As far as I know the Bosch on a 2.1TD XM is a VP20 and identical physically to the VP20 on the pre '96 1.9TDs before the AS3 was fitted. It's fully mechanical but will have differing fuelling and timing characteristics to suit the 2.1TD.

It'll be unarmoured so easy enough to tweak. It's worth an experiment if it's cheap and if not good, as Mark says, flog it to a veggie 2.1TD owner with an EPIC.

Mark, Thanks for the dead EPIC, it's now on my bench awaiting attention :D :D :D :D
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Post by Xaccers »

Will see how much they'll want for it :)

Mark, I've tweaked the smoke screw, and, assuming it's in as good condition as it looks, I'll be swapping the cat for the straight pipe on the LX I'm breaking.
What turbo tuning do you do? :)
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Post by mark21td »

I tuned my 405 (lucas) as per this site

http://www.club-306.com/guides/306_turbo_tuning

But for a Bosch pump this is bettor

http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/eve/forums/ ... 1931086722

This is how I'm going to do my xantia, I'm lucky as I have one of the last non ecu / egr 1.9td's so it'll be realy easy, I've just got to get some new/recon injectors first.
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Post by deian »

mark21td wrote: But for a Bosch pump this is bettor

http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/eve/forums/ ... 1931086722
Fantastic link mark. I fiddled with my old zx, sadly people were complaining about the smoke so i had to turn it down, maybe I went over the top without fine tuning the other little things.

I'll do it properly with this volcane i'll get.
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Post by mark21td »

CitroJim wrote:
Mark, Thanks for the dead EPIC, it's now on my bench awaiting attention :D :D :D :D

No problem jim, in fact it worked out great as DickieG wouldn't take any money for looking at my car on the strenth of you where getting the epic to play with.
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Post by MikeT »

CitroJim wrote:It's fully mechanical but will have differing fuelling and timing characteristics to suit the 2.1TD.
Hello Jim, may I bother you for a copy of that data please? I've been studying these pumps in more detail lately and that would be a fabulous addition to what I've learned so far but I only know it as the VE. Is the VP a later and therefore different model?
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Post by MikeT »

MikeT wrote:
CitroJim wrote:It's fully mechanical but will have differing fuelling and timing characteristics to suit the 2.1TD.
Hello Jim, may I bother you for a copy of that data please? I've been studying these pumps in more detail lately and that would be a fabulous addition to what I've learned so far but I only know it as the VE. Is the VP a later and therefore different model?
Or anyone else got the info please?
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Post by MikeT »

Ok, I think I got it - the 2.1 has a different cam-plate, right? I thought there was some info on specific timing values. As far as I can determine, the pumps deliver up to 24 degrees at full advance - assuming a within-spec IP that is.

As for the VE, that's a broad code covering a wide range of types of which mine is the axial-pump, distributor type. I've looked for numbers but can only see a bar code on my pump, perhaps a serial number. But I can't find any info about what VP20 and and other codes used AS4 is it?

Xac, the reason I asked if yours is mechanical or electro-mechanical is because you might have a pressure problem affecting timing leading to less power and economy. All pumps wear but it's not obvious how bad they can be in-situ as they will run regardless. A few simple tests and a minor tweak can compensate for it if the fuel viscosity isn't within spec. Some non-citroen engine owners report up to 20% better consumption by resetting this pressure! 8) Though ours are probably not so bad.

I'll be testing mine when tuning begins and will post the details if anyone's interested in trying it themselves.
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