Having read nearly every post on the subject I thought I had 'cured' my C5 It is a 51 reg 2.00 hdi estate with 112,000 miles on the clock. I cleared the announcement and the warning light by switching on and off 6 times and locking and unlocking the car. Used it twice today, all ok. Third time all ok till I switched it off. The engine seemed to'run on' for only about half a second. When I restarted the Antipollution warning returned. Cleared it again using same method. Anyone had this symptom before. I share the thoughts of many owners who consider it time Citroen face up to the task of getting it right without resorting to parts swapping and using us as guinea pigs.
I have only had this one just over a week. Already I have had to repair a broken wire on the boot release and although the solenoid works on the upper glass window it fails to operate through the microswitch
In the past I have had three ds, two cx, 5 bx oh and a 2cv and I still love the marque but reliability is fast becoming a byword. Gone are the days when we could happily get the grease gun and a couple of spanners and enjoy an afternoon rolling around under the car.
Antipollution fault
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Citroenmad
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Its odd to have an antipollution light on a 2.0HDi, thats usually reserved for 2.2HDis with their FAP filters etc. So im not sure what it could mean on the 2.0HDi 
The problem with the upper rear window is the wire for the release is in the window heating element, its a very common thing to break on the C5 estates, i gather very few actually work!
However, i notice this months Citroenian mentions the fix is to replace the rear window glass - what an expensive option just to have the rear hatch glass opening again!
Anyway, that is not needed, as i found out when we got our 2.0HDi estate. When we went to view the car for sale at a local citroen specialist the rear glass hatch was not opening. So the garage had a fiddle around and managed to do a rather neat job of repairing it.
What they did was find where the wire comes from at the top of the screen, the attached a thin bit of wire to that, ran it around the inside frame of the glass, under some black insulation tape and into the wipermotor/glass hactch switch to operate the button and catch. It works perfectly and you can not notice the wire unless you are looking for it, its a very neat repair. I could post a picture if you like?
You do seem to get reliable cars and not so, it depends on how they have been looked after and if any small jobs have been kept on top of. But there is not much tinkering to be done on the C5s, nope. Generally though the engines last forever, using good quaility fuel prolongs the injectors, which is about the only thing which can go on them.
The 2.0Hdi is a great engine though, we have two C5s and a 206 with that engine, so far so good. Economical, refined and punchy, the Peugeot is a right hoot!
Ah, one thing id strongly recommend, get a can of air intake cleaner from somewhere, warm up the engine, remove the air intake pipe from just behind the air filter box, and while someone is reving the car to around 2500rpm spray spurts of it though thr pipe. If yours is anything like our lot there will be lots of black smoke and noise, but it will certainly feel much more lively and give better MPG. Give the car a good blast afterwards. Doing this transformed our Peugeot and C5 estate. Its especially useful if the car has previously been chugged around at low revs. This might just cure your antipollution fault.
Good luck, Chris.
The problem with the upper rear window is the wire for the release is in the window heating element, its a very common thing to break on the C5 estates, i gather very few actually work!
However, i notice this months Citroenian mentions the fix is to replace the rear window glass - what an expensive option just to have the rear hatch glass opening again!
Anyway, that is not needed, as i found out when we got our 2.0HDi estate. When we went to view the car for sale at a local citroen specialist the rear glass hatch was not opening. So the garage had a fiddle around and managed to do a rather neat job of repairing it.
What they did was find where the wire comes from at the top of the screen, the attached a thin bit of wire to that, ran it around the inside frame of the glass, under some black insulation tape and into the wipermotor/glass hactch switch to operate the button and catch. It works perfectly and you can not notice the wire unless you are looking for it, its a very neat repair. I could post a picture if you like?
You do seem to get reliable cars and not so, it depends on how they have been looked after and if any small jobs have been kept on top of. But there is not much tinkering to be done on the C5s, nope. Generally though the engines last forever, using good quaility fuel prolongs the injectors, which is about the only thing which can go on them.
The 2.0Hdi is a great engine though, we have two C5s and a 206 with that engine, so far so good. Economical, refined and punchy, the Peugeot is a right hoot!
Ah, one thing id strongly recommend, get a can of air intake cleaner from somewhere, warm up the engine, remove the air intake pipe from just behind the air filter box, and while someone is reving the car to around 2500rpm spray spurts of it though thr pipe. If yours is anything like our lot there will be lots of black smoke and noise, but it will certainly feel much more lively and give better MPG. Give the car a good blast afterwards. Doing this transformed our Peugeot and C5 estate. Its especially useful if the car has previously been chugged around at low revs. This might just cure your antipollution fault.
Good luck, Chris.
Chris
07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
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01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
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93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10
07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
07 Citroen C5 HDi VTR - Red
09 Citroen C3 1.4i VTR - Silver
01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
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93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10
Antipollution fault
Thanks for your thoughts Chris. I had thought of a 'rewire job' on the rear window but as you said it is not that important. I think your concealed wire would be the best route to use. Does it attatch to the microswitch?
Regarding the intake cleaner you might have hit the nail on the head. I have now covered 600 miles since the purchase. It had a new mot when I purchased it and it failed on emisions. I didn't find out what they did but I guess they gave it some stick to clean out the bores. It only covered 4000 miles in two years with an elderly lady driving it to the shops etc. I forgot to add it's an auto with tiptronic and it carries the scars from the supermarkets and a couple from something more substantial. In the 600 miles it has performed well and lived up to the reputation of the HDi engine.
The only other thing to attend to is the a/con which is doing nothing. I must say it's a lot of car for the money
Roger
Regarding the intake cleaner you might have hit the nail on the head. I have now covered 600 miles since the purchase. It had a new mot when I purchased it and it failed on emisions. I didn't find out what they did but I guess they gave it some stick to clean out the bores. It only covered 4000 miles in two years with an elderly lady driving it to the shops etc. I forgot to add it's an auto with tiptronic and it carries the scars from the supermarkets and a couple from something more substantial. In the 600 miles it has performed well and lived up to the reputation of the HDi engine.
The only other thing to attend to is the a/con which is doing nothing. I must say it's a lot of car for the money
Roger
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Citroenmad
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Hi Roger, yes the microswitch now works as normal, ill post a picture if i remember.
Ah, that could well be the problem with it then, some fuel system cleaner might also be benificial in that case. Id certainly try cleaning the intake, usually works wonders on all cars, even if they appear to be running as normal.
Our cars all get a good blast regularily so it saves the built up of dirt and soot in the system, however its always something i do when i get a new car.
Is it an LX or SX with climate you have?
It might just want a regass, does the ac compressor cut in when you turn the AC on? You can usually hear it click on and off under the bonnet. Usuall if its low on gass it will just stop working.
Chris.
Ah, that could well be the problem with it then, some fuel system cleaner might also be benificial in that case. Id certainly try cleaning the intake, usually works wonders on all cars, even if they appear to be running as normal.
Our cars all get a good blast regularily so it saves the built up of dirt and soot in the system, however its always something i do when i get a new car.
Is it an LX or SX with climate you have?
It might just want a regass, does the ac compressor cut in when you turn the AC on? You can usually hear it click on and off under the bonnet. Usuall if its low on gass it will just stop working.
Chris.
Chris
07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
07 Citroen C5 HDi VTR - Red
09 Citroen C3 1.4i VTR - Silver
01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
.
93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10
07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
07 Citroen C5 HDi VTR - Red
09 Citroen C3 1.4i VTR - Silver
01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
.
93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10
"Antipollution fault" on PSA diesels is just a bit of badly translated French. It really means "Fuel System Fault", not necessarily anything to do with the emissions as such.
If its running on after the key has been turned off it suggests a sticking fuel pressure regulator (on the back of the high pressure pump). This may even be a result of the car hardly getting any use with the previous owner, and might sort itself out with use. I think a dose of a decent fuel system cleaner in the tank would help too, as has been suggested.
If its running on after the key has been turned off it suggests a sticking fuel pressure regulator (on the back of the high pressure pump). This may even be a result of the car hardly getting any use with the previous owner, and might sort itself out with use. I think a dose of a decent fuel system cleaner in the tank would help too, as has been suggested.
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steelcityuk
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I had this 2 yrs ago on my 406.After lots of money & being fobed off(it needs a new hp pump etc)when the fault returned within a week,it has a new sensor(fuel rail pressure sensor i think).
Any way,the same fault returned a few months ago.I got some fuel off a friend who had emptied a storage tank.As soon as i put pump fuel back in,the fault cleared.Try`ed another tank of the "dirty" fuel,& sure enough the fault returned,went intp limp home mode & kept cutting out,& running on for a few secs.
After much searching,it would seem these engines only like clean fuel.I would think there was a bit of muck in the fuel i got even though i filtered it 2 times.And yes,it was white diesel.A bit of muck can affect the sensors giving Anti pollution fault.Also,"dry"fuel from super markets can too.Have read a few articals about putting 3 ltrs of engine oil in with the fuel every now & then to lubracate the pump & sensors.The fuel filters on HDI`s are not very effective either for small particals.
It it runs on when you switch the engine off,that will be the common rail emptying itself of fuel/pressure,as the switch could be gummed up/defective.
Any way,the same fault returned a few months ago.I got some fuel off a friend who had emptied a storage tank.As soon as i put pump fuel back in,the fault cleared.Try`ed another tank of the "dirty" fuel,& sure enough the fault returned,went intp limp home mode & kept cutting out,& running on for a few secs.
After much searching,it would seem these engines only like clean fuel.I would think there was a bit of muck in the fuel i got even though i filtered it 2 times.And yes,it was white diesel.A bit of muck can affect the sensors giving Anti pollution fault.Also,"dry"fuel from super markets can too.Have read a few articals about putting 3 ltrs of engine oil in with the fuel every now & then to lubracate the pump & sensors.The fuel filters on HDI`s are not very effective either for small particals.
It it runs on when you switch the engine off,that will be the common rail emptying itself of fuel/pressure,as the switch could be gummed up/defective.
53`406 est SE Hdi 140,110k
It certainly seems to be fuel related. Today it has behaved all day. Next week I have a 300 mile day trip. Will run some cleaner through and add some to the diesel.
What is it about supermarket fuel that causes problems? I have heard loads of complaints. My bx 1.9 never missed a beat on Asda fuel yet my neighbour with a 2.2HDi won't go near the pumps. He reckons his car runs like a Lada on Asda diesel.
Thanks for all your help.
What is it about supermarket fuel that causes problems? I have heard loads of complaints. My bx 1.9 never missed a beat on Asda fuel yet my neighbour with a 2.2HDi won't go near the pumps. He reckons his car runs like a Lada on Asda diesel.
Thanks for all your help.
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cachaciero
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O.K Gentlemen I am tired of reading various weird and wonderful explanations so lets have a bit of clarity on the "AntiPollution" message.
It is an EC requirement that any malfunction of the engine control system that would cause the engine to perform in such a way that the emission levels could increase beyond approved limits must be advised to the driver that's what the message is telling you and it can come up for a variety of reasons. My understanding is that all cars manufactured since about 2000 for use in the EU have to have such a system, although the message content may differ on some cars all that you may get would be the engine management light on.
If whatever the problem is is such that it could cause damage to the engine then the ECU will put limits on the engine such that it stays outside the "damage" envelope sometimes refered to as limp or get you home mode.
So you can get Anti Pollution message but otherwise everything runs o.k or you can get Anti Pollution and Limp Mode engine managment etc. I feel it unlikely that you will get Limp mode without an Anti Pollution Message as well but hey this is PSA.
As I said the Anti Pollution Message can come up for a variety of reasons, Turbo problems, air leaks. EGR and you can go on, the one thing it DOES'NT come up for on the 2,2 at least is a FAP problem, which has it's own set of warnings.
The only way to really know which of the various scenarios is causing the problem is to get it on an analyser, without some guidance from the printout it's pure speculation as to which bit of the engine is causing the problem.
Note to Moderator could I suggest that you make this a sticky?.
Cachaciero
It is an EC requirement that any malfunction of the engine control system that would cause the engine to perform in such a way that the emission levels could increase beyond approved limits must be advised to the driver that's what the message is telling you and it can come up for a variety of reasons. My understanding is that all cars manufactured since about 2000 for use in the EU have to have such a system, although the message content may differ on some cars all that you may get would be the engine management light on.
If whatever the problem is is such that it could cause damage to the engine then the ECU will put limits on the engine such that it stays outside the "damage" envelope sometimes refered to as limp or get you home mode.
So you can get Anti Pollution message but otherwise everything runs o.k or you can get Anti Pollution and Limp Mode engine managment etc. I feel it unlikely that you will get Limp mode without an Anti Pollution Message as well but hey this is PSA.
As I said the Anti Pollution Message can come up for a variety of reasons, Turbo problems, air leaks. EGR and you can go on, the one thing it DOES'NT come up for on the 2,2 at least is a FAP problem, which has it's own set of warnings.
The only way to really know which of the various scenarios is causing the problem is to get it on an analyser, without some guidance from the printout it's pure speculation as to which bit of the engine is causing the problem.
Note to Moderator could I suggest that you make this a sticky?.
Cachaciero
I can't argue with that statement. In my book it clarifies the situation. Having had three vehicles all with the advisory messages. However, informative though it is, I'm afraid it doesn't and can't help the poor driver who has the message repeat itself after paying the stealers to put it out.
I had a Fiat Multi that threw up messages every other day and the ecu failed to record one fault. My argument is that we are having to pay to have the light reset only to have it come on again the next week.
If the system was foolproof the ecu/stealer would say we have to replace xyz and this is the cost. That would be the end of the problem.
Through the help of these forums comes little gems of wisdom that sometimes help the owner to sort out the problem without lining the pockets of the stealers.
As I started this thread I have to say that on two occasions I managed to reset the light and with the advice I received to run some BP Ultimate through the system and for the last 600 miles all is well.
So guys thank you all for your help. I can at least for a while enjoy driving my C5. Till the next time
I had a Fiat Multi that threw up messages every other day and the ecu failed to record one fault. My argument is that we are having to pay to have the light reset only to have it come on again the next week.
If the system was foolproof the ecu/stealer would say we have to replace xyz and this is the cost. That would be the end of the problem.
Through the help of these forums comes little gems of wisdom that sometimes help the owner to sort out the problem without lining the pockets of the stealers.
As I started this thread I have to say that on two occasions I managed to reset the light and with the advice I received to run some BP Ultimate through the system and for the last 600 miles all is well.
So guys thank you all for your help. I can at least for a while enjoy driving my C5. Till the next time
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cachaciero
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- x 9
As far as I remember the "Anti Pollution" warning is not latched once the ignition is switched off infact I'm not sure it's latched at all only coming on when the engine is running and something is not right if whatever it is that is wrong is intermitent it will I believe clear itself as soon as the problem disappears so you really don't need anyone to clear it. However one would expect the ECU to have recorded whatever it is that is wrong.blueboy wrote:I can't argue with that statement. In my book it clarifies the situation. Having had three vehicles all with the advisory messages. However, informative though it is, I'm afraid it doesn't and can't help the poor driver who has the message repeat itself after paying the stealers to put it out.
I had a Fiat Multi that threw up messages every other day and the ecu failed to record one fault. My argument is that we are having to pay to have the light reset only to have it come on again the next week.
If the system was foolproof the ecu/stealer would say we have to replace xyz and this is the cost. That would be the end of the problem.
Through the help of these forums comes little gems of wisdom that sometimes help the owner to sort out the problem without lining the pockets of the stealers.
As I started this thread I have to say that on two occasions I managed to reset the light and with the advice I received to run some BP Ultimate through the system and for the last 600 miles all is well.
So guys thank you all for your help. I can at least for a while enjoy driving my C5. Till the next time
For any fault that puts the car into limp mode if after stopping and starting the engine the problem is no longer present the car will run normally but the engine managment light will stay on for three trouble free start and run cycles after which it will clear so again you don't really need a stealer to clear the system for a "one off" event but you do need him to read the system to discover what fault it is that caused the problem, the fault is always stored even if the management light has subsequently cleared.
If the engine is permanently in limp mode then you have no option but to get it on to an analyser.
Foolproof rarely exists anywhere in spite of mans best endeavours, even in the aviation world where shed loads of money are spent trying to make aircraft foolproof they havn't succeeded so there is no chance with anything priced down to the level at which your average car has to be built at.
As regards your comments about Stealers couldn't agree more although I believe that the fault lies with the Stealers rather than the manufacturer. The Stealers more often than not don't have people with the necessary knowledge and analytical skills to understand either the car or the use and limitations of the test equipment they have.
Franchised Citroen dealers / repairers have no excuse they have access to training material and the Citroen knowledge base.
Independants have a much harder job, without access to that level of support but having said that they are very often the better bet and often in spite of the difficulties have made a better job of understanding the cars they service, because IMHO they have employed people who are better and brighter than many of the people employed by large franchises run on corporate lines with H.R departments and all the other idiocies that go on in big organisations.
Citroens down the years have had a bad press for reliability but I feel that the truth is not that they are inherently anymore unreliable than anything else from the factory it is because they have generally been more technically advanced and different.
Then when something has gone wrong the subsequent service / repair work (done by mechanics who really only understood Ford GM et al) has made things worse because the trade did'nt know what it was doing when it was trying to fix them thus turning what often was a small problem into a big one or while one problem appears to get cured often unwittingly creating another one then after a period of this the car is considered unreliable.
The C5 I have appears to have been maintained through much of it's life by relatively knowledgeable independants in 96K miles the number of major defects that it has had i.e things that have failed requiring urgent unscheduled maintenance is 0.
It has had tailgate window locking failure a problem known to Citroen and that has been fixed, it has had a lock failure and a blower fan failure and laterly a swirl valve actuator fail none of these is a big deal to fix if you know the car and I would suspect that most cars of similar age and mileage have had equivalent problems yet the car has been pretty well universally panned as being unreliable I just can't agree with that.
I have had a string of Citroens GS, CX and XM all of which had been panned by the press as unreliable yet none of those cars were by any stretch unreliable during my ownership but they were all maintained by someone who really knew the cars and on the rare occasion when there was a problem could diagnose it accurately and fix or get it fixed right first time.
Cachaciero