XANTIA 1.9 TD SX 1999 STARTING PROBLEM

Post by **CitroJim** » 30 Mar 2009, 12:27

Peter.N. wrote: What's with the test card? That used to be my trade.

My first trade too Peter

I started repairing TVs at the age of 12 and spent evert weekend and summer holiday at our local TV shop and worked there after leaving school and beginning my career as an HF Radio engineer..

TCF brings back some very special memories. I developed a rapport with the Philips G6 dueal-standard colour TV (I'm sure you knew and loved them!) and used to spend hours in front of them with TCF converging them. Great to do it first on 405 lines and then switch to 625 and do it all over again

Oh, happy times...

sparky33 · Post by **sparky33** » 31 Mar 2009, 11:38

It will most likely be the cold start mechanism on the pump.

They incorporate a wax stat that holds the cable, when stone cold it pulls the cable in which moves the arm, when hot it releases the arm, the nipple on the cable slips, so whils the engine is stone cold you need to pull the arm in towards the mechanism and adjust the nipple to hold it in place.

I did write a full guide on another forum with pics but I've no longer got access to it.

xantia 1.9td 1999 · Post by **xantia 1.9td 1999** » 04 Apr 2009, 08:25

Update
it happened again this morning, the car would not start, it didnt start whilst cranking it over, i thought it might be the glow plugs as suggested so i ran the coil a good few times with no joy so i decided to throw the car into reverse with the clutch engaged, as i cranked the key their was life and a lot of white smoke.

Does this suggest glow plugs??

I have had a look for leaks around the daisy chained pipes around the glow plugs or are they injectors, i have no machanical background guys, cant really see diesel leaks and the clear pipe that runs from the fuel filter to the pump appears to have no bubbles, i assume this indicates no air trapped.

If it is glow plugs can someone recommend which brand. many thanks

sparky33 · Post by **sparky33** » 05 Apr 2009, 19:28

Like I said previously, check the cold start mechanism

White smoke is caused by raw, unburnt fuel passing into the exhaust stream. Common causes include ..

Incorrect fuel injection timing
Defective fuel injectors
Low cylinder compression
Low cylinder compression may be caused by leaking valves, sticking piston rings, ring wear, cylinder wear, or cylinder glaze.

When white smoke occurs at cold start and then disappears as the engine warms up, the most common causes are fouling deposits around piston rings and/or cylinder glazing.

Continuous evidence of white smoke indicates a mechanical defect, or incorrect fuel timing.

citroenxm · Post by **citroenxm** » 06 Apr 2009, 18:48

CitroJim wrote:
myglaren wrote: Should have been "306". Anybody's guess where "310" came from.
Maybe you're looking into the future Steve There's a 308, 309 has been and gone and so what next for Pugs medium car: The 310! Simple.

Your son will take delivery of one in, say, 2012?

Yes, the deletion of the bulb was daft, either by Citroen or a deranged mechanic. Used ionce in a blue moon given, but essential for bleeding the system although with enough cranking, the lift (transfer pump) will eventually suck some up...

Nice try, But Peugeot apparently will NEVER issue a car with a 1 in the middle, this is because you have COPYRIGHTED the 0 in the middle, as Porsche found out when they introduced the 911.. it was orinally called the 901, but had to with draw it and use 911 because of Peugeots 0 badging policy....

Rgds
Paul

falling-out-with-my-car · Post by **falling-out-with-my-car** » 07 Apr 2009, 09:31

What about the stop solanoid there may be an intermittant fault there perhaps a wiring issue? why does everyone go for air in the system or fuel supply straight away? if it was air it would get worse and worse and finally you wouldn't be able to start the car at all without priming the filter housing with diesel manually.

Have you tried running the glow plugs twice in the mornnings? that is turn the key on let the light go out then re-turn the key to heat them a second time before turnning the key to ignition, you might have a couple of faulty glow plugs.

regards Nigel.

Post by **Peter.N.** » 09 Apr 2009, 12:06

Hi Jim

A bit off subject and late, but we have been in the far reaches of northern Sctland for the last week or so.

I started in TV in '54, when there were still a lot of sets with mains EHT

, went through the change to multi channel 405 operation and then UHF. I remember the G6 well, all valve decoder! I retired about five years ago but still have a couple of sets out on rent, one has the GEC 20AX chassis! We go digital next month, and it has no scart socket ... Don't understand modern electronics, bring back valves I say

Peter.

citroenxm · Post by **citroenxm** » 09 Apr 2009, 12:40

So the TV's are usefull for starting yur XUd Peter

Sorry! Hope yur trip was good!

Good to see you back, theres been a mad DERV discussion else were I think, unless this is the one, Ive not looked back, and Iwondered were you were..

Regards
Paul

xantia 1.9td 1999 · Post by **xantia 1.9td 1999** » 09 Apr 2009, 22:56

falling-out-with-my-car wrote:What about the stop solanoid there may be an intermittant fault there perhaps a wiring issue? why does everyone go for air in the system or fuel supply straight away? if it was air it would get worse and worse and finally you wouldn't be able to start the car at all without priming the filter housing with diesel manually.

Have you tried running the glow plugs twice in the mornnings? that is turn the key on let the light go out then re-turn the key to heat them a second time before turnning the key to ignition, you might have a couple of faulty glow plugs.

regards Nigel.

thanks, i have tried the glow plugs between 2 and 5 times in the morning when it happened lately. Im thinking it might not be glow plugs as its ocassionally doing it, their appears not to be any air in the system as the clear pipe from the fuel filter housing to the pump seems clear and full i.e. no bubbles. I need to try and find this cold start mechanism on the pump, not sure what im looking for as i am no machanic, i will have a look at the haynes manual which i am picking up tomorrow. with reagrds to reply from SPARKY33, once the car start its fine all day and maybe afew days after, the engine appears fine, pulls well etc.

sparky33 · Post by **sparky33** » 15 Apr 2009, 19:25

You can't miss the cold start mech', it's an arm on the front of the pump, with a cable that comes from an housing sat on top of the coolent inlet.

To test the glow plugs, remove them, there is a special tool available for this (example of which is in the 306 section on my site, makes removing the one behind the pump easy).

Then connect a wire to the positive on the battery, attach the wire to the threaded section ad then earth the main body, take care as the glow plug will get very hot, you could create some cables with crocodile clips to do it.

If the tip of the glow plug turns red then the plug is fine, if it glows in the middle or near the main body it's shot.

Glow plugs don't play a big part in starting a diesel, as it's down to the compression, the glow plugs just lend an helping hand when the engine is stone cold.

Lost compression is usually the main enemy of a diesel not glow plugs.

Just had another thought too, make sure that the "coffin" seal from the intercooler to the inlet fanimold is ok, buy a new one and replace it, only a couple of quid.

xantia 1.9td 1999 · Post by **xantia 1.9td 1999** » 16 Apr 2009, 11:39

sparky33 wrote:You can't miss the cold start mech', it's an arm on the front of the pump, with a cable that comes from an housing sat on top of the coolent inlet.

To test the glow plugs, remove them, there is a special tool available for this (example of which is in the 306 section on my site, makes removing the one behind the pump easy).

Then connect a wire to the positive on the battery, attach the wire to the threaded section ad then earth the main body, take care as the glow plug will get very hot, you could create some cables with crocodile clips to do it.

If the tip of the glow plug turns red then the plug is fine, if it glows in the middle or near the main body it's shot.

Glow plugs don't play a big part in starting a diesel, as it's down to the compression, the glow plugs just lend an helping hand when the engine is stone cold.

Lost compression is usually the main enemy of a diesel not glow plugs.

Just had another thought too, make sure that the "coffin" seal from the intercooler to the inlet fanimold is ok, buy a new one and replace it, only a couple of quid.

thanks again, is their a simple way to test the cold start mechanism, also what is the coffin seal, i have bought a haynes manual waiting for it to come through the post. recently mot'ed the car, the NS wheel bearing needs doing not sure if its adjustable. Will book into a machanic. The only down thing is that i cant seem to locate a good citroen machanic local. i dont want to pay dealer prices for obvious reasons.