XANTIA 1.9 TD SX 1999 STARTING PROBLEM

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XANTIA 1.9 TD SX 1999 STARTING PROBLEM

Post by xantia 1.9td 1999 »

Can anyone help? I have recently experienced starting problems with my car. The problem at this stage seems very intermittent, it’s happened 3 times over the course of 2 weeks.

The problem has propped up whilst starting the car early in the morning, whilst turning the ignition it doesn’t fire up but does turn over hope this makes sense, recently when it happened I tried putting the car in 1st gear and turning the key over which dragged the car maybe a meter and then it started.

Can it be the glow plugs?, im not sure as its fine most days, also on the days its given me problems starting, after the initial start in the morning its been ok all day even if parked up for long periods of time..
Any ideas? has someone else had the same experience / advice etc. Many thanks
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Post by myglaren »

This pops up all the time. Quite a variety of causes but as you have suspected, glow plug defects are usually on the front rank, also fueling problems. Have you tried squeezing the priming bulb? If it is soft first thing, there is air in the fuel system which is guaranteed to cause starting problems.
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Post by xantia 1.9td 1999 »

myglaren wrote:This pops up all the time. Quite a variety of causes but as you have suspected, glow plug defects are usually on the front rank, also fueling problems. Have you tried squeezing the priming bulb? If it is soft first thing, there is air in the fuel system which is guaranteed to cause starting problems.
My car does not have a priming bulb, i know it might sound strange, i dont think its norm, possibly been removed, the car has been serviced and manintained by citroen all its life prior to me having it so i dont know whats happened there, citroen perhaps removed it, same engine as my 306td which did have one.
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Post by CitroJim »

Not sure I like the red font...

The priming bulb was deleted from late models so it's no massive surprise you don't have one.

As steve says, It'll be either glowplugs or small air leaks causing your issues. Basically, the air leaks cause the diesel in the pump to drain back into the tankl and some cranking is needed to pump it back up again, by which time the glowplugs have gone cold so no start...

The favourite place for air leks is on the leak-off pipes daisy-chained between the injectors. They're a doddle to replace.

The next candidate is the fuel filter housing and pipes leading to and from it.

If air is the problem you'll see big bubbles in the transparant feed pipe from the filter to the pump as you crank the engine. Also if the problem is lack of fuel, you'll see no smoke out of the exhaust during a start attempt.

If the glowplugs are at issue, you'll see white/grey smoke issue from the exhaust during cranking. This is unburned fuel.

The afct it started in gear is odd. It may be a tired battery just turning it over too slowly to start. A diesel really loads a battery and they will soo how themselves weak. A disels alo needs to spin above a certain speed to start. If it seems to crank slowly, replace the battery.
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Post by myglaren »

You must have one with a lift pump in the tank then.

When it is quiet, turn on the ignition and listen for a whirring sound from the rear of the car as the pump primes the system - or not, as the case may be.

It must be working though or the car would never start. Perhaps there is a slight leak in the fuel line allowing the diesel to run back into the tank after a long rest (overnight)

The trick for detecting it seems to be to replace the final parts of the fuel line with transparent hose and look for air bubbles or a complete lack of fuel there.

Also the injector leak-off lines harden and crack and let air into the return line, need renewing every few years, worth checking them too.

All this is parrot-fashion from previous posters experiences, haven't personally experienced this problem.
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Post by Peter.N. »

1.9s don't have a lift pump, they have a 'proper' injection pump which includes a transfer pump :D
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Post by myglaren »

Is that a later standard? I had a 1.9 TD that had a priming bulb.
Couldn't say which pump it was though. Nothing ever went wrong with it and I was quite happy with that.
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Post by xantia 1.9td 1999 »

CitroJim wrote:Not sure I like the red font...

The priming bulb was deleted from late models so it's no massive surprise you don't have one.

As steve says, It'll be either glowplugs or small air leaks causing your issues. Basically, the air leaks cause the diesel in the pump to drain back into the tankl and some cranking is needed to pump it back up again, by which time the glowplugs have gone cold so no start...

The favourite place for air leks is on the leak-off pipes daisy-chained between the injectors. They're a doddle to replace.

The next candidate is the fuel filter housing and pipes leading to and from it.

If air is the problem you'll see big bubbles in the transparant feed pipe from the filter to the pump as you crank the engine. Also if the problem is lack of fuel, you'll see no smoke out of the exhaust during a start attempt.

If the glowplugs are at issue, you'll see white/grey smoke issue from the exhaust during cranking. This is unburned fuel.

The afct it started in gear is odd. It may be a tired battery just turning it over too slowly to start. A diesel really loads a battery and they will soo how themselves weak. A disels alo needs to spin above a certain speed to start. If it seems to crank slowly, replace the battery.

Thanks for reply, and the red text, sorry wasnt trying to offend anyone guys, red stands out a little better and doesnt blend in with the black my opinion. many thanks
Last edited by xantia 1.9td 1999 on 29 Mar 2009, 13:52, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Peter.N. »

Yes, the lift pump only comes with the HDi engines, the IDIs 'suck' the fuel up.
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Post by myglaren »

Peter.N. wrote:Yes, the lift pump only comes with the HDi engines, the IDIs 'suck' the fuel up.
In that case, should ther not be a priming bulb?
My son's 310 1.9 D-Turbo has one.
Must have a look to see if I have one, one day - I'm sure I saw one in there once :)
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Post by Xaccers »

myglaren wrote:
Peter.N. wrote:Yes, the lift pump only comes with the HDi engines, the IDIs 'suck' the fuel up.
In that case, should ther not be a priming bulb?
My son's 310 1.9 D-Turbo has one.
Must have a look to see if I have one, one day - I'm sure I saw one in there once :)
They can perish letting in air, so "clever" mechanics sometimes just remove them rather than replace them.
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Post by myglaren »

Yep, very 'clever' of them. Until you run out of diesel :(

Should have been "306". Anybody's guess where "310" came from. A moment of insanity perhaps.

Or the reverse 8)
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Post by CitroJim »

myglaren wrote: Should have been "306". Anybody's guess where "310" came from.
Maybe you're looking into the future Steve :lol: There's a 308, 309 has been and gone and so what next for Pugs medium car: The 310! Simple.

Your son will take delivery of one in, say, 2012? :wink:

Yes, the deletion of the bulb was daft, either by Citroen or a deranged mechanic. Used ionce in a blue moon given, but essential for bleeding the system although with enough cranking, the lift (transfer pump) will eventually suck some up...
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Post by myglaren »

CitroJim wrote: Used ionce in a blue moon given, but essential for bleeding the system although with enough cranking, the lift (transfer pump) will eventually suck some up...
Which makes it look like air in the system as continued cranking will eventually fire it up
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Post by Peter.N. »

Hi Jim

What's with the test card? That used to be my trade.
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