Was going to post this yesterday but having read through the thread I thought the problem would be solved by greasing the front struts. Did it this morning, 20 mile test drive and still the same ie.Too hard.
Info
As far as I know the spheres are less than a 7 months old and all except the accumulator are new genuine parts.
Dickie G kindly tested out the hydractive gubbins and all is fine.
LHM changed and filters cleaned about 3 months ago.
Filled with hydraflush/rinceage about 1 month ago.
Symptoms
Copes with big bumps but crashes hard over say a manhole cover.
Pushing down on the front wings, even pressure both sides,but MUCH harder
than my previous 1.9D lx saloon.Rear is much softer than front.
Since putting in the Rinceage it has been softening up slowly(I think)couple of weeks ago took family (4 adults)out and the car rode like a dream just as it should.Sadly next day it was back as it was.About a week later the car softened up again,lovely I thought that Rinceage is great stuff it's finally cleaned out whatever's been making the car stiff,I went to bed a happy man that night.
Next morning was greeted by the LHM level warning light and a sizeable puddle of LHM/Rincage cocktail under the car.Turned out to be a split rubber connector on top of the (I assume)brake pressure regulator taking a plastic return tube to the resevoir.After much cursing I managed to repair it.Whilst driving to pick up another gallon of rinceage, with barely enough fluid in to make the PAS work ,I remember thinking how good the suspension was.Sadly not to last,back to stiff the next day,much headscratching.Disconnected tube,blew it through seems OK.CheckedLHM flow to resevoir seems OK
Having read thread yesterday the penny dropped.All that LHM flying around under the car must have lubricated the struts hence the greasing job today.
I gave the struts one wipe of grease on high setting and much Citroenobics was that enough
More citrenobics after test drive and a few times the suspension jumped in the opposite direction ie up when going down ,this seemed to coincide with the anti sink switching on and off.
Apologies for this post being a bit disjointed.Can anyone throw any light on this please
Xantia Hard Suspension
Moderator: RichardW
The prime suspect : the large diameter pump feed hose from the reservoir.
Is this hose in good nick, no surface cracks, especially NOT over the studs at pump and reservoir ?
And both ends are tightly clamped to the studs by good working hoseclamps ?
This hose is under vacuum by the pump, and will therefore suck in air if it is leaking.
Air in the hydraulic system gives the same bad ride as flat spheres - because of the "splash" effect :
Try move your hand down from free air onto a water surface - fast.
It feels like hammering your hand onto a rigid surface.
Now try move your hand fast submerged in the water. No trouble - except the resistance from the water.
The suspension cylinder acts the same way to air on the hydraulics side of the suspension cylinder.
Is this hose in good nick, no surface cracks, especially NOT over the studs at pump and reservoir ?
And both ends are tightly clamped to the studs by good working hoseclamps ?
This hose is under vacuum by the pump, and will therefore suck in air if it is leaking.
Air in the hydraulic system gives the same bad ride as flat spheres - because of the "splash" effect :
Try move your hand down from free air onto a water surface - fast.
It feels like hammering your hand onto a rigid surface.
Now try move your hand fast submerged in the water. No trouble - except the resistance from the water.
The suspension cylinder acts the same way to air on the hydraulics side of the suspension cylinder.
Anders (DK) - '90 BX16Image
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PicassoPigeon
- Posts: 197
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- Location: Plymouth, Devon, UK.
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Using chain wax has given the best ride so far, its in a spray can. How long it lasts will be interesting to find out.
gav425
*EDIT*
Thats using chain wax on the struts. Sorry.
Guess I can just keep using more over a few days to see if it will loosen up more and more.
gav425
gav425
*EDIT*
Thats using chain wax on the struts. Sorry.
Guess I can just keep using more over a few days to see if it will loosen up more and more.
gav425
2002 Citroen Xsara Picasso 2.0HDi
125,000 miles
125,000 miles
Anders DK
Inspected the hose yesterday and no cracks and factory seals still in place.On closer inspection the join between the 90 degree rubber piece and the hose (at the resevoir end) was starting to lift very slightly.I wrapped some elasticated hose repair bandage around the area much citrobics and the car is transformed.Thank you so much.It still feels a lot stiffer than my old 1.9LX but is most acceptable.Is this a characteristic of the VSX Hydractive? Just checked the front spheres Numbered N45334 one dated3/
8/06 one 25/5/07 is this correct?Any idea on price of new hose?
Thanks
Isisalar
Inspected the hose yesterday and no cracks and factory seals still in place.On closer inspection the join between the 90 degree rubber piece and the hose (at the resevoir end) was starting to lift very slightly.I wrapped some elasticated hose repair bandage around the area much citrobics and the car is transformed.Thank you so much.It still feels a lot stiffer than my old 1.9LX but is most acceptable.Is this a characteristic of the VSX Hydractive? Just checked the front spheres Numbered N45334 one dated3/
8/06 one 25/5/07 is this correct?Any idea on price of new hose?
Thanks
Isisalar
J reg 1.9d auto BX first Citroen
M reg 1.9d auto Xantia lx
N reg 1.9 td Xantia VSX Estate
T reg 2.0HDI Xantia Exclusive Estate Present car
M reg 106 diesel red
L reg 106 diesel white
02 Saxo 1.1i desire wife's present car(sadly now very ill cambelt gone- Doh)
M reg 1.9d auto Xantia lx
N reg 1.9 td Xantia VSX Estate
T reg 2.0HDI Xantia Exclusive Estate Present car
M reg 106 diesel red
L reg 106 diesel white
02 Saxo 1.1i desire wife's present car(sadly now very ill cambelt gone- Doh)
The N45334 code is correct for a GSF front hydractive. The differing dates
wont be a problem if they've been fitted together on the car at the same
time therefore having matched use/forces applied to them.
The stiffness of VSX suspension over LX may very well be better body
control but it would be worth considering the central spheres front and
back to help the normal setting of the hydractive - many only see the
corner spheres without realising they're just half the story on a VSX.
Have you tried using the hydraulic flush in the system as this will help
improve any fatigue in the system due to suspended rubbish in the fluid?
Andrew
wont be a problem if they've been fitted together on the car at the same
time therefore having matched use/forces applied to them.
The stiffness of VSX suspension over LX may very well be better body
control but it would be worth considering the central spheres front and
back to help the normal setting of the hydractive - many only see the
corner spheres without realising they're just half the story on a VSX.
Have you tried using the hydraulic flush in the system as this will help
improve any fatigue in the system due to suspended rubbish in the fluid?
Andrew
Thanks Andrew
All spheres except the accumulator w ere replaced at the same time so I was told by the previous owner.They certainly look to be the same age. Been running on rincage for about 2000 miles now.The accumulator sphere was charged for but not changed at a Citroen dealer and I changed it myself with one from a local motor factor.
The rear of the car sinks within a minute of switching off and the pressure regulator hardly ever clicks.On the 1.9lx it would click about once a minute.Could any of these things affect the ride ?
Thanks
Isisalar
All spheres except the accumulator w ere replaced at the same time so I was told by the previous owner.They certainly look to be the same age. Been running on rincage for about 2000 miles now.The accumulator sphere was charged for but not changed at a Citroen dealer and I changed it myself with one from a local motor factor.
The rear of the car sinks within a minute of switching off and the pressure regulator hardly ever clicks.On the 1.9lx it would click about once a minute.Could any of these things affect the ride ?
Thanks
Isisalar
J reg 1.9d auto BX first Citroen
M reg 1.9d auto Xantia lx
N reg 1.9 td Xantia VSX Estate
T reg 2.0HDI Xantia Exclusive Estate Present car
M reg 106 diesel red
L reg 106 diesel white
02 Saxo 1.1i desire wife's present car(sadly now very ill cambelt gone- Doh)
M reg 1.9d auto Xantia lx
N reg 1.9 td Xantia VSX Estate
T reg 2.0HDI Xantia Exclusive Estate Present car
M reg 106 diesel red
L reg 106 diesel white
02 Saxo 1.1i desire wife's present car(sadly now very ill cambelt gone- Doh)
To be fair you're not far away from removing the flushing Hydraurinçage
and a fresh 5 litres of LHM may now make the difference as the flush will
have picked up the detritus into the reservoir filters which will need removal
and cleaning.
The accumulator sounds OK with the long cycling of the pump/regulator and
the sinking quick at the back could well be due to the car not being fitted
with the additional reserve or so called anti sink sphere at the back.
The simple appearance of spheres is never a failsafe and it wont be the first
time incorrect ones are fitted or even supplied ignorantly by GSF etc. IIRC
new GSF ones may have the sphere details printed on their crown but the
original Citroen one's have a stamping showing pressure but not the 'jet'
details (until their full removal) although the volume is fairly obvious by
comparison.
If you feel confident the correct spheres are fitted recently and the car
generally feels OK the difference with the LX you have as a comparison
may simply be the more controlled operation of the hydractive.
Ultimately, new fluid could make the final improvement!!
Andrew
and a fresh 5 litres of LHM may now make the difference as the flush will
have picked up the detritus into the reservoir filters which will need removal
and cleaning.
The accumulator sounds OK with the long cycling of the pump/regulator and
the sinking quick at the back could well be due to the car not being fitted
with the additional reserve or so called anti sink sphere at the back.
The simple appearance of spheres is never a failsafe and it wont be the first
time incorrect ones are fitted or even supplied ignorantly by GSF etc. IIRC
new GSF ones may have the sphere details printed on their crown but the
original Citroen one's have a stamping showing pressure but not the 'jet'
details (until their full removal) although the volume is fairly obvious by
comparison.
If you feel confident the correct spheres are fitted recently and the car
generally feels OK the difference with the LX you have as a comparison
may simply be the more controlled operation of the hydractive.
Ultimately, new fluid could make the final improvement!!
Andrew
Andrew
The car has 7 spheres if thats any help
Thanks
Isisalar
The car has 7 spheres if thats any help
Thanks
Isisalar
J reg 1.9d auto BX first Citroen
M reg 1.9d auto Xantia lx
N reg 1.9 td Xantia VSX Estate
T reg 2.0HDI Xantia Exclusive Estate Present car
M reg 106 diesel red
L reg 106 diesel white
02 Saxo 1.1i desire wife's present car(sadly now very ill cambelt gone- Doh)
M reg 1.9d auto Xantia lx
N reg 1.9 td Xantia VSX Estate
T reg 2.0HDI Xantia Exclusive Estate Present car
M reg 106 diesel red
L reg 106 diesel white
02 Saxo 1.1i desire wife's present car(sadly now very ill cambelt gone- Doh)
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xantia 1.9td 1999
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xantia 1.9td 1999
- Posts: 50
- Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 11:29
- Location:
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isisalar wrote:Thanks Andrew
All spheres except the accumulator w ere replaced at the same time so I was told by the previous owner.They certainly look to be the same age. Been running on rincage for about 2000 miles now.The accumulator sphere was charged for but not changed at a Citroen dealer and I changed it myself with one from a local motor factor.
The rear of the car sinks within a minute of switching off and the pressure regulator hardly ever clicks.On the 1.9lx it would click about once a minute.Could any of these things affect the ride ?
Thanks
Isisalar
WHAT IS rincage IS IT DIFFERENT TO LHM. Also my pressure regulator clicks every 15/20 seconds. I take that this is not normal and perhaps that their is air trapped in the system, How can i rectify this. I am new to xantia's. Help?
-
xantia 1.9td 1999
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- Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 11:29
- Location:
- My Cars:
Can someone email some pics if its not too much trouble or have a look at the "know your engine" thread and explain what i need to do. Regardsxantia 1.9td 1999 wrote:isisalar wrote:Thanks Andrew
All spheres except the accumulator w ere replaced at the same time so I was told by the previous owner.They certainly look to be the same age. Been running on rincage for about 2000 miles now.The accumulator sphere was charged for but not changed at a Citroen dealer and I changed it myself with one from a local motor factor.
The rear of the car sinks within a minute of switching off and the pressure regulator hardly ever clicks.On the 1.9lx it would click about once a minute.Could any of these things affect the ride ?
Thanks
Isisalar
WHAT IS rincage IS IT DIFFERENT TO LHM. Also my pressure regulator clicks every 15/20 seconds. I take that this is not normal and perhaps that their is air trapped in the system, How can i rectify this. I am new to xantia's. Help?
Citroen Aerobics = Citaerobics = play with the height setting to move the height full up and full down. This will make the hydraulic LHM fluid rush back & forth in the system, withdrawing any air/gas escaped & trapped from diffusing spheres. The air will vent out quietly in the reservoir.
- with car at standstill ONLY
Driving at speeds with the suspension height set to low or maximum height is very dangerous, as the suspension then rides on the rubber bump stops alone.
The whole car bounces all over like a tennis ball ...
You have been warned !
Rincage = Hydrarinqage (french) = hydrocleanse. A special variant of the hydraulic LHM fluid to shift out the old LHM and dirt from the system.
The dirt will be trapped under a baffle on the bottom of the reservoir, while driving the car with the fluid for some 2-3K miles.
The procedure is to set the car to lowest height with engine idle. This will return as much fluid as possible to the reservoir.
Then stop engine.
Now you can unplug and remove the reservoir, empty it, lift up & clean the baffle disc, clean reservoir inside, and clean the plastic manifold filter inserts.
Its a messy - but very easy - job to be done at regular intervals of some 36K miles.
- with car at standstill ONLY
Driving at speeds with the suspension height set to low or maximum height is very dangerous, as the suspension then rides on the rubber bump stops alone.
The whole car bounces all over like a tennis ball ...
You have been warned !
Rincage = Hydrarinqage (french) = hydrocleanse. A special variant of the hydraulic LHM fluid to shift out the old LHM and dirt from the system.
The dirt will be trapped under a baffle on the bottom of the reservoir, while driving the car with the fluid for some 2-3K miles.
The procedure is to set the car to lowest height with engine idle. This will return as much fluid as possible to the reservoir.
Then stop engine.
Now you can unplug and remove the reservoir, empty it, lift up & clean the baffle disc, clean reservoir inside, and clean the plastic manifold filter inserts.
Its a messy - but very easy - job to be done at regular intervals of some 36K miles.
Anders (DK) - '90 BX16Image
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admiral51
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Have a look here it shows you how to do lhm/hydraflush change with pics very informativexantia 1.9td 1999 wrote:
Can someone email some pics if its not too much trouble or have a look at the "know your engine" thread and explain what i need to do. Regards
Post some questions of what your not sure about with regards to the "engine thread" and im sure you will get some help
As to the Accumulator sphere ticking this could be down to blocked filters/old fluid or just an old/tired sphere
Colin
That's fine then - your car, whilst having the centre Vsx hydractive spheresisisalar wrote:Andrew
The car has 7 spheres if thats any help
Thanks
Isisalar
as well as the corner and accumulator isn't fitted with anti sink suspension
so it will be normal for the back to sink reasonably quickly.
Get the hydraflush and filters cleaned out with new LHM and you'll probably
then experience the ride the car is designed to provide at its optimum range!
Andrew