Xantia Softer Spheres

wrinklet1 · Post by **wrinklet1** » 25 Mar 2008, 21:17

Hi all,
I am going to replace the rear spheres on my 'new' xantia. I want to get a softer ride, so, could I put spheres for a Bx onto the car instead of xantia ones??? if so whaich ones??? oh and i would be getting them from GSF

Paul

Post by **aerodynamica** » 25 Mar 2008, 23:47

Hi, I temporarily fitted the spheres of my CX on the Xantia for a week - the suspension was really smooth but still well damped.

For softer suspension on a Citroen you need a higher rest pressure in the spheres - don't go trying to do things to the damper valve! it's too hard to get right and things like drilling the central hole is madness.

The rear BX ones are 400cc, 40bar with a 1.1 mm dia bleed hole on the damper, this is the same as the low end Xantias like mine: 1.9D, The TD and the 16v Xants of non-hydractive have stiffer spheres; rear 400cc, 30bar, 1.0 diameter bleed hole. 10 bar difference is quite a lot.

The BX Carburator estate had the same pressure(40b) and damper but was 500cc volume giving a slower rate of change of the spring.

The CX rears are 500cc, 40bar, 1.25mm dia damper hole and are pretty darn soft. I say slap a pair of these on the Xantia! I tried them and they were really good.

The only thing that screws up all ^that^ is if your car has Hydractive type suspension, then there's more to talk about.

Let us know what you get and how it affects it.

Post by **Peter.N.** » 26 Mar 2008, 19:31

For a very soft ride on a hydractive, fit non hydractive spheres. It will be normal in 'sport' mode and very soft in normal.

Post by **aerodynamica** » 27 Mar 2008, 20:57

That's interesting - I've heard this before about the hydractive. I'd be more interested in keeping sport mode the same but maxing the comfort mode to mega soft levels..

Maybe only possible by recharging the center spheres and lowering the outer ones?

Post by **CitroJim** » 27 Mar 2008, 21:09

It would be most interesting to try non-hydractive spheres on an Activa to see what happens. Anyone ever tried?

alan s · Post by **alan s** » 27 Mar 2008, 22:15

I once chucked a couple of CX front spheres on my VSX whilst I waited for new ones to arrive.
Might just be our pretty average kinds of roads over here, but it frightened the crapper out of me at a bit of speed when I pulled out to pass another car.
As the car went to offcamber, it seemed to lose all stability, just felt like the wheel alignment was out or like a conventional car with faulty shock absorbers.
'twould be a very brave man who stuck them on an Activa based on that experience.

Alan S

Post by **Peter.N.** » 27 Mar 2008, 22:33

The only way to keep the taught ride in sport and have a softer ride in normal is to fit 'comfort' spheres. I have them on my XM but am not sure if they make them for the Xantia. They have a slightly larger orifice and so reduce damping.

DickieG · Post by **DickieG** » 27 Mar 2008, 23:39

citrojim wrote:It would be most interesting to try non-hydractive spheres on an Activa to see what happens. Anyone ever tried?

Me

I run my Activa with non Hydractive front sphere's in an effort to soften the front end which I find to be quite harsh at times and have no handling problems whatsoever. I wouldn't use them on the rear though as that is quite soft enough already.

I run my VSX TD and HDi Exclusive estate on non Hydrative sphere's and enjoy the comforting ride as I don't thrash around in them. My V6 runs on standard (genuine) sphere's and you can certainly feel the difference, small ripples felt in the V6 are aborbed in the other two car's.

alan s · Post by **alan s** » 28 Mar 2008, 06:24

Just out of curiosity, before anybody has gone throwing different spec spheres on their Xantia Hydractive, has anyone ever bothered to have the hydractive and anti sink spheres tested first?
Because either I have a well padded posteria, you guys have worse roads than we do, (highly unlikely) or some of these Xantia drivers have supersensitive bums. A Xantia VSX in soft mode I've always found to be just under CX standard and better than a BX. I've also found a couple of H/A2 cars with good suspension spheres but pretty ordinary HA and AS spheres and replacing them seems to make one helluva difference.
To me swapping suspension spheres if the others under the car are flat is like taking morphine for a brain tumour; hides the pain, but you still have the brain tumour, so not a really good result.

Alan S

steelcityuk · Post by **steelcityuk** » 28 Mar 2008, 12:31

I agree with your comments Alan. I fitted comfort spheres to a fully working XM VSX, I took them off after less than 5 days....

But...

It does seem to be the case that some, maybe alot of Hydractive Citroens aren't as smooth/comfy as they should be. Out of 3 Citroens, all with Hydractive 2, only one had a floaty ride. The problems on mine seem to manifest themselves as what could be best described as a 'jiggly' ride on non smooth surfaces. This is after replacing all the spheres, stripping and cleaning the Hydractive blocks and electrovalves, hydroflushing the system, adding diodes to the ECU along with a status LED that can be seen when driving to show the car really is in soft mode and even increasing the system pressure a little to make sure the Hydractive valves do swap over to soft mode. If the car is in hard mode you can tell that the ride is firmer still.

Still trying to sort this, same as many owners by the looks of things.

Steve.

DickieG · Post by **DickieG** » 28 Mar 2008, 16:29

In answer to the above, I fitted non Hydractive sphere's to my VSX when it was just 2 or 3 years old having done little more than 10,000 miles so it was (and still is working 100%) it all depends on what you're looking for from a car and how you use it, if I was thrashing around corners in the car then yes I would leave it as standard.

I recently connected up my ELIT to my Activa and went for a drive whilst it monitored what the suspension was doing, not only switching between firm and soft, the anti-roll electrovalve switching from soft to firm to counteract roll but also the body movement in steps. It was quite interesting in that unless you are coarse with the throttle or steering application or release, the suspension rarely switches between modes, however the anti-roll sphere was switching at the mere sight of a bend

But as with most things in life especially a cars suspension, a compromise has to be struck and in a manufacturers case they produce cars to a specification that they believe will help sell the most cars, so in Citroëns case they have to cater for owners who wish to throw a car around bends as well as offering a reasonable ride comfort. By fitting alternative sphere's (softer or harder) you simply tilt the balance in whatever direction suits you.

For example I recently drove a new Audi A6 2.7 TDi for several weeks and couldn't stand the ride on the car, I was constantly bouncing around in the seat at the mere sight of a ripple in the road, quite how anyone would want to have suspension with those settings is lost on me unless you intend to throw it around every bend, if I had bought that car I would have returned it the the dealer within days and asked for my money back.

steelcityuk · Post by **steelcityuk** » 28 Mar 2008, 16:52

>>For example I recently drove a new Audi A6 2.7 TDi for several weeks and couldn't stand the ride on the car, I was constantly bouncing around in the seat at the mere sight of a ripple in the road, quite how anyone would want to have suspension with those settings is lost on me

I'd guess they'd been listening to too many Clarkson, Butler-Henderson reports.

You're right about how you want your car to feel but on the XM I had them fitted to (XM S2 2.1 manual) it was over the top, it went from a lovely cosseting ride that firmed up nicely into a wallowing boat in a storm that seemd to make the car double in size and weight. In that case more wasn't better for me. I sold the spheres onto Lez Briddon at the Wetherby meet.

Steve.

mattpc · Post by **mattpc** » 28 Mar 2008, 21:16

My 2p worth is that my first xantia was an m plate 1.9TD SX. With new spheres on this always rode brilliantly wafting along perfectly. With my 2nd xantia a 110 HDI SX even with new spheres I never felt it rode quite as well. My current vehicle an HDI Exclusive Estate rides ok. It's got the hydraflush in at the moment tho so we will have to wait and see. Despite the special hyrdractive II suspension I still don't think this one is going to ride as well as the TD SX. Wierd really.

Post by **CitroJim** » 28 Mar 2008, 21:39

There is no doubt in my mind that we are spoilt by our hydropneumatic cars, especially those of us that drive them exclusively. It is easy, after a while, to become complacent and forget just what a fine job it does until we either drive or ride in a conventionally sprung car. Although I find my Activa a bit hard after my 2.1 I still find anything else even harder and harsher. A late Mondeo is very much a case in point for me. The last time I rode in one I thought I was on a roller coaster in Alton Towers... Another one that seemed rock hard and harsh to me was a late'ish Xsara Picasso.

Encouraged by this thread, I'll give a set of non hydractive spheres a try on the front of my Activa. As you say Richard, the Activa front-end is a bit on the hard side for the state of UK roads these days, especially when a lot of town work is undertaken that includes a good few speed bumps.

Is there any tips for storing used spheres? My Activa spheres are recent and now increasingly rare. If I take them off, I would like to ensure I look after them and avoid any deterioration in storage.

I really must get round to wiring in my suspension LED display in my Activa too.

Post by **aerodynamica** » 28 Mar 2008, 22:49

Is there any tips for storing used spheres? My Activa spheres are recent and now increasingly rare.

Hi Jim, it's probably best to keep the plastic caps you get with new spheres and fit them on the Activa set for storage. That way there's less chance of bits of grit getting in the damper.

This would be wise especially if the sphere was an accumulator as any grit etc on the neck of the sphere could get pumpd into the LHM circuit and grind away at some highly finished valve like a steering pinion valve of a height corrector.

G