Now got a fuel leak

lolingram · Post by **lolingram** » 04 Aug 2007, 06:31

I bid for mine on eBay (and won it for £15). It was correctly described from a Xantia/P306TD which is good enough as these are all much the same I understand. It is still sitting on my workshop shelf, as the problem turned not to be the pump!

How do you tell a good used pump pump from a bad one? I don't even know what model mine is and I've never removed or fitted one before, is it a straight replacement job?

weety · Post by **weety** » 04 Aug 2007, 18:08

easy to fit.....the flywheel? driven by the cambelt is locked in place by two or three bolts so you dont have to adjust the cambelt

then unbolt fuel lines, remove throttle cable and unbolt pump

a er haynes one spanner job really

TehAgent · Post by **TehAgent** » 08 Aug 2007, 20:55

wow, someone posted the same problem as I'm having, again 100% veg, doesn't look like the pump its self, just something underneath it that's leaking veg all over the road..

MikeT, have you had any luck in sorting yours out, i am on a really tight budget IE: cant afford to do nothing about it until after September now.

Unless its just a simple case of changing a rubber seal.

the leak was just running off the bottom of the engine early, but i noticed that when i had it parked with the back higher than the front, it didn't leak, even when the engine was running ? but soon as the car was level, it started dripping again,

But your symptoms sound the same as mine

- 100% veg
- Dripping quite fast
- Dripping slowed
- Dripping from under the fuel pump
- Bosch fuel pump

Post by **CitroJim** » 08 Aug 2007, 21:36

Hi Ian

Long time no hear... Trust all is otherwise well?

This leak. If it was a Lucas Pump I'd know exactly what it was. they suffer from leaky lids and throttle and cold-start spindles due to O rings going hard over time.

Normally, the Bosch does not suffer in the same way but it does have a similar seal arrangement for the throttle spindle and as I say, I may be wide of the mark here but I wonder if the veggie is attacking these O rings over time and causing the leak.

You both will very carefully need to clean up your pumps and try to see precisely where the veg is leaking from. A good disposable mirror to use in looking for leaks is an old CD. Used in conjunctione with a maglite it works a treat.

The good news is that repair kits containing new seals are available for not too much and the job is not that difficult as long as you work in scrupulous clenliness

TehAgent · Post by **TehAgent** » 08 Aug 2007, 22:13

was hoping you were still here jim

Didn't think vegetable oil could eat through a rubber O ring? do you think this is the case? or could it be, because the cleaning properties of veg, that it has shifted diesel deposits and has left a hole some where?

thing that strikes me as strange, is it doesn't seem to be coming from any where that fuel goes into or out of the pump? i would of thought that it came in from the fuel filter, then thought the pump, then out to the engine all via two pipes? or am i way off the mark and there is in fact a 3rd exit so to speak.

I noticed that the fuel pump seems to be two pieces that are bolted together, thus needing an head gasket of some kind, can a fuel pump "blow a head gasket" ? or again, am i way off the mark,

Its just very annoying as on the 15th me an tes have to go to the US embassy in London to renew her passport, and the only transport we have is the car.

weety · Post by **weety** » 08 Aug 2007, 22:36

TehAgent wrote:was hoping you were still here jim

Didn't think vegetable oil could eat through a rubber O ring? do you think this is the case? or could it be, because the cleaning properties of veg, that it has shifted diesel deposits and has left a hole some where?

thing that strikes me as strange, is it doesn't seem to be coming from any where that fuel goes into or out of the pump? i would of thought that it came in from the fuel filter, then thought the pump, then out to the engine all via two pipes? or am i way off the mark and there is in fact a 3rd exit so to speak.

I noticed that the fuel pump seems to be two pieces that are bolted together, thus needing an head gasket of some kind, can a fuel pump "blow a head gasket" ? or again, am i way off the mark,

Its just very annoying as on the 15th me an tes have to go to the US embassy in London to renew her passport, and the only transport we have is the car.

pump that i had leak was leaking out where it bolted on to the engine....unfortunately i changed the pump rather than investigate why it was leaking

Post by **CitroJim** » 08 Aug 2007, 22:44

Still here Ian, This is my second home

Yep, Rubber is funny stuff and it is surprising what will eat it. LHM for instance, will eat some kinds of rubbers, hence the seals are made of special stuff. The SVO you and Mike are using contains fatty acids and in fact in the making of biodiesel, these acids are removed. These acids would appear to me to be more than able to eat rubber over a period of time. They can also cause corrosion of alloys.

I could do a test actually. I have a load of surplus O rings from Lucas pump repair kits and I could soak a few in Costco finest and see what happens.

Of the couple of pumps I've had in bits, they have been sparkling clean inside as they only handle clean diesel straight from the filter so there is no cleaning for the SVO to do in the pump. In fact, in this state, real diesel is a fair cleaning agent. It is possible the fatty acids in the SVO could have corroded a small hole but it's unlikely in such a short time.

All gasket surfaces in the pump are sealed by O rings so yes, It could have its own version of a blown head gasket.

Yes, the pump has a fuel inlet from the filter, an excess fuel return and a smaller inlet from the leakoff pipes. The only output is from the four HP pump ports on the end to the injectors. There is the throttle spindle that needs sealing against leaks. What is also present is small diaphragms for the boost sense etc. Basically, there are plenty of places they can leak.

As I say, a good clean and close inspection with everything clean should reveal the source. You need to check too the front bearing seal just behind the drive sprocket (off the cambelt) as if SVO is leaking from here it can be flicked around somewhat by the sprocket and belt which will make finding the true source tricky. Try running with the front part of the cam cover removed for a bit. You need to pop it off anyway to ensure the cambelt has not become contaminated if the front seal is leaking.

For the US Embassy trip Ian, I'd take the train. Used to be an excellent service from Wellingborough back in the days when I lived up your way. Just me but I

driving in London.

TehAgent · Post by **TehAgent** » 09 Aug 2007, 20:23

Jim. found out where its leaking from, its not the bottom as was previously thought its actually on the front of the fuel pump near the top.

Post by **CitroJim** » 09 Aug 2007, 20:37

Hi Ian,

That'll either be the stop solenoid or the throttle spindle leaking. I'll wager it is the stop solenoid. On yours it is a bit hard to reach with anti-theft armour in the way

Reasonably cheap to fix though. Just replace the seal under the solenoid or at worst, the solenoid itself

There used to be, may still be, a execellent Diesel Specialist up on the Finedon Road Industrial Estate run by a fantastic Kenyan-Indian chap called Vic. He may even still recall me

TehAgent · Post by **TehAgent** » 09 Aug 2007, 21:01

could i do it my self if i had the tools? i can see they are torx screws, think they are t30's

JIM helllppppp

Post by **CitroJim** » 09 Aug 2007, 21:36

[quote="TehAgent"]JIM helllppppp

[/quote

Come down and see me either tomorrow evening Ian, or on Sunday. I'll be only too happy to see if we can make it happy again.

You'll have to come here as I may need tools and stuff that is not portable.

I'm sending you a PM

TehAgent · Post by **TehAgent** » 09 Aug 2007, 21:54

PM'ed back, I'm losing about 1 coke cap full of fuel every 2 Min's at the rate its dripping at, so the sooner i get it done the better

MikeT · Post by **MikeT** » 11 Aug 2007, 13:50

TehAgent wrote:MikeT, have you had any luck in sorting yours out, i am on a really tight budget IE: cant afford to do nothing about it until after September now.

Hi TehAgent, I haven't done anything to fix mine as it's not a bad leak (at worst, one drip per minute while the engine is running) and, like you, I am short of cash. Additionally, I'm worried that if I have the pump serviced the leak may occur again as the cause is unknown. I still plan to take it to another specialist as I've yet to identify where it's leaking from exactly.

The main DIY stumbling block I'm facing is my ignorance of the pump bearing in mind it's a calibrated, finely engineered unit. As well as the risk of introducing foriegn particles (which would probably cause further failures) I'm worried about upsetting the timing.