Was this a service - or not?

[Ross_K]

I don't know the details but I am 99% certain that the law changed recently and manufacturers can no longer insist on servicing being done at a franchised dealer while the car is under warranty- as long as genuine parts are being used.

http://www.dti.gov.uk/ccp/topics1/facts/blockcars.htm

[Homer]

It's not unknown for an owner to be presented for a bill for more hours than the car spent on the premises.

I've heard that more than once. The excuse that goes with it is usually along the lines of "more than one mechanic worked on the car", sometimes two or three of them at the same time!

No, it's because they bill you at "book time", i.e. how long the service manual says the job should take. The trouble comes if the mechanics get paid by book time, so if it takes them 2 hrs to do a 1 hr job they only get 1hr pay. Of course, if they can do the job in half the time then they can double their wage.
It's not rocket science to see why cars come out with only half the bolts holding the gearbox on (for instance).

[ACTIVE8]

Maybe they had the work experience kid on it, although you have not had a wind up like this done on you !

http://uk.download.yahoo.com/pr/fu/oa/ishedead.mp3

There is another wind up going on at your main dealer, which is too much money for too little work.

What's their labour rate ?

Also see if you can speak to who worked on it, then you can determine from the conversation as to if you had the work experience lad, the apprentice, or the technician.

.

[alan s]

It sounds like out here isn't the only place these things happen then. The best I heard was from a guy who owned a new Holden (Vauxhall) a couple of years back who claimed it was by far the most reliable car he'd ever owned, but then added it was also the car that he had spent more money on in routine services than he had on all the cars he'd owned previously combined.
I get the impression that profits percentagewise are not as hgh as they have been in the past when they sell the car new, but now the dealers are compensating for this by effectively having profits donated by new owners with these over inflated service charges.
Out here, they also have laws that allow for service to be performed by non dealers but this is being exploited by a couple of franchised service companies who do the job for slightly less but from some of the ones I've seen, not always to a better standard and in my opinion, if you were to have a problem arise and it was found a certain service hadn't been done by a franchised company, the dealer would take great delight in wiping the warranty claim, whereas if he's done the neglected service, he'd possibly cover the fact and put it through warranty.
Best option would be a well known and trusted repairer who you've dealt with before if you want to stand a chance of proper service at a reasonable cost.


Alan S

[micitroen]

Swmbo has a Hyundai 4x4, which is a great car! But enough of that; they allow you you to have the car serviced at any garage that is registered for VAT to qualify for and keep your warranty intact.
However, their prices for the work they do (I always supply my own oil, got caught once ..not by this garage... and there's no way I'm ever going to pay £10 a litre for ordinary oil again!) are actually very reasonable and being that they are so close to home (walking distance) I tend to take it there anyway.

[goldfinche]

Hello I hate to say it but as alan said find somewhere thats good by word of mouth if possible and stick to them. Have had a lot of experiance of garages. The one by where I used to live reused split pins, nylocks,etc. the MOT failures were frequent, an example of only a couple of days ago was a friend of mine has a V W beetle it was leaking oil from the rear main bearing hence clutch slip, it went in clutch replaced seal done (hopefully we will see.) when he drove it home it was not quite right but it had to be used, now this chap has no mechanical knowedge whatever, went to work and it was struggling to go up the slightest slope, after work took it to the garage and the "young lad" ,his words, took it round the block and said he could find nothing wrong with it, words were said and the proper mechanic had a look with much grumbling.
Go on guess. -------------------------- The plug leads were on the wrong way round on two pots so it was running on 2 pots only.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
But you see there was nothing wrong with it.
Its bloody unbelieveable.
Go carefull out there.
Cheers.
Geoff.

[PowerLee]

For the sake of the warranty, I put my one year old C5 in to a main dealer for the first service. I haven't yet had an invoice listing what's been done, but since it cost me £255, I would expect all filters to have been changed. I've had the air filter out and clearly it hasn't been changed since it has autumn leaves in it, but how about this fuel filter? My guess is that its been in there for its 10K miles. A new filter is alongside the one that's supposed to have been changed. What's your opinion on the fuel filter?
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i53/Johndug/Fuel.jpg

Have you not got a service book, it will list all the details for each servicing.

Spot on, The items that are down to be changed & checked at each service are in the service book that should have come with the car.

There's normally 3 service levels A , B & C plus at intermediate service level.

[JohnD]

The air filter and fuel filter aren't changed at the first service!

As I remember, my C5 got oil, oil filter and pollen filter.

Having looked at the car some more, they have changed the pollen filter, but not the air or the fuel filter. It's anybody's guess whether they did the oil filter. The current Citroen maintenance book is very ambiguous. It's a 'one size fits all' book covering every model, both petrol and diesel, from C2 up to 2.8 Relay. Then different service intervals are required for normal or severe usage. "Standard Operations" are "to be carried out systematically". There's no clue as to how often. Standard Operations include pollen filter, diesel fuel filter TDi & HDi, air filter on Relay HDi.

Although my service was done three weeks ago, I'm still awaiting an invoice to see exactly what I'm being charged for. A computer breakdown is the excuse.

[JohnD]

After four weeks of pestering I’ve got hold of the invoice for my first service, and as Bencowell said, the only things scheduled to be done are oil and filter and pollen filter. So how did they turn that into 250 quid? Labour is quoted at £131. 5ltrs of Total 9000 cost £40, with the filter being a surprisingly modest £8. Last time I did my daughter’s Xsara HDi, 5ltrs of Total 9000 cost me £17 at GSF and took no more than half an hour. On the invoice the sump washer was £2. I recently bought a packet of 4 14mm crush washers for a pound! The pollen filter was billed at £30 with several other ‘doubtful’ amounts added. Engine flush added £13.50. I questioned this, asking why an engine needed flushing after 10K on synthetic. It’s standard practice because it keeps the engine clean!! £7 was accounted for with “Environmental oil disposal! Another £13.50 for Fuel line cleaner. (A squirt of Miller’s in the tank?) A further £4.50 and £2 accounted for Antifreeze top up and Washer liquid. A complete rip-off – but the price that’s got to be paid to maintain a warranty. In a year’s time I might say, s—the warranty!

[mezuk04]

£30 for the pollen filter, crikey! Mine at the local motor shop is only about £9-11 from memory.

To conclude I would have to say that is one big rip-off and its awful to think they can get away with it, or can they??

If it were me I really would sod the warranty, I just wouldnt give them the money.

Even the sump washer is about £1.50 over-priced.

[bxbodger]

A main dealer service will follow the book to the letter- if changing the air filter isn't listed for that particular service then they won't do it. Silly I know!! Your service book should indicate what is and isn't done at each service.

Although the law says that you can now get it serviced elsewhere using genuine parts and still maintain the warranty, in practice you'll be up the creek without a paddle if anything does go wrong!! They'll just say that there's no proof that the correct manufacturers service procedures were followed and it therefore invalidates the warranty....I recall reading something about a BMW owner who had his car serviced elsewhere other than the main dealer and had great difficulty getting his warranty honoured, he had to take it to court in the end.

We all know main dealer servicing is a scam and they do to, but if you intend changing the car in 3 or 4 years time then you'll easily recoup the costs simply because any trader or buyer who sees non-franchise service stamps will immediately knock a grand off the offer!!

[howiedean]

After four weeks of pestering I’ve got hold of the invoice for my first service, and as Bencowell said, the only things scheduled to be done are oil and filter and pollen filter. So how did they turn that into 250 quid? Labour is quoted at £131. 5ltrs of Total 9000 cost £40, with the filter being a surprisingly modest £8. Last time I did my daughter’s Xsara HDi, 5ltrs of Total 9000 cost me £17 at GSF and took no more than half an hour. On the invoice the sump washer was £2. I recently bought a packet of 4 14mm crush washers for a pound! The pollen filter was billed at £30 with several other ‘doubtful’ amounts added. Engine flush added £13.50. I questioned this, asking why an engine needed flushing after 10K on synthetic. It’s standard practice because it keeps the engine clean!! £7 was accounted for with “Environmental oil disposal! Another £13.50 for Fuel line cleaner. (A squirt of Miller’s in the tank?) A further £4.50 and £2 accounted for Antifreeze top up and Washer liquid. A complete rip-off – but the price that’s got to be paid to maintain a warranty. In a year’s time I might say, s—the warranty!

I've never had a car serviced by Citroen before so I don't know but do they have a fixed service cost? It might be worth ringing around to find a better deal. National tyres only charge a couple of pound for oil waste disposal, but we won't go that.

The other question I'd have is, where else can you get the car serviced that will not invalidate the warranty? The C5 is known for having lots of computers, would other non Citroen garages be able to meet the serving criteria without having complicated electronic equipment?

Regards

[mezuk04]

Its something in the sense that the warranty isnt invalidated if you use either a pre-approved garage OR the garage uses all Citroen parts (so to speak) and their workmanship is up to the Citroen standard

I read this off WhatCar a few times a while ago people asking if their new cars can be servcied elsewhere and its the 2nd part that I remember reading that WhatCar said.

[Kowalski]

After four weeks of pestering I’ve got hold of the invoice for my first service, and as Bencowell said, the only things scheduled to be done are oil and filter and pollen filter. So how did they turn that into 250 quid? Labour is quoted at £131. 5ltrs of Total 9000 cost £40, with the filter being a surprisingly modest £8. Last time I did my daughter’s Xsara HDi, 5ltrs of Total 9000 cost me £17 at GSF and took no more than half an hour. On the invoice the sump washer was £2. I recently bought a packet of 4 14mm crush washers for a pound! The pollen filter was billed at £30 with several other ‘doubtful’ amounts added. Engine flush added £13.50. I questioned this, asking why an engine needed flushing after 10K on synthetic. It’s standard practice because it keeps the engine clean!! £7 was accounted for with “Environmental oil disposal! Another £13.50 for Fuel line cleaner. (A squirt of Miller’s in the tank?) A further £4.50 and £2 accounted for Antifreeze top up and Washer liquid. A complete rip-off – but the price that’s got to be paid to maintain a warranty. In a year’s time I might say, s—the warranty!

Next time, research what is going to be done at the service and provide the parts yourself, that way, all they can charge you for is the labour.

[ChevronMicky]

....It might be worth ringing around to find a better deal....

That's certainly true. I did just that for my C5's last service and saved around £200! Various dealers quoted anywhere between £200 and £400 for the same service. A bit of healthy competition is about the only weapon consumers have against the dealers' greed, but voting with your feet is quite a formidable weapon.