Heavy steering on Xantia

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randomx
Posts: 17
Joined: 04 Dec 2002, 02:24
Location: Ireland
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Heavy steering on Xantia

Post by randomx »

hello all
was on earlier in the week complaining about heavy steering on a xantia 1.9td. the main suggestion was to change the LHM fluid and cleen filters. did this today and after at first thinking things had improved the problem is still there.
(running now with hydraflush)
im wondering if you guys have any more ideas on what the problem could be, I dont know much about the steering system, the Haynes is a bit sketchy on this topic.
thanks for the help
michael
Dave Burns
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Post by Dave Burns »

Need to know what system is on your car, you don't say what year it is, the changeover from FDV to independant supply for steering was around mid 94 I think.
In any event look at the hydraulic pump, if there is only one steel high pressure pipe from it, its early, if there are two its later.
The early one has the FDV this has (two I think) small filters in it that can become blocked.
If its a later type the trouble could be coming from the pinion valve seals or even the ram its self.
Dave
p.s FDV = Flow Distributor Valve
randomx
Posts: 17
Joined: 04 Dec 2002, 02:24
Location: Ireland
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Post by randomx »

Dave
I checked the pump, as far as I can see there are two pipes, one at either side of the supply from the reservoir.
I guess this means that there is no filters to be cleaned ?
(The suspension and brakes are fine, pump seems to be working normally)
How do I go about faultfinding the ram etc, can i lft the front and do any checks that might narrow things down a bit ?
Regards Mike.
michael
Dave Burns
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Post by Dave Burns »

A bit remiss of me regarding my earlier post, but the pump could also be the component in trouble, the pressure relief valve might be faulty or a valve in one or more of its cylinders.
Is there no power assistance to the steering at all.
Does it feel the same in both directions.
Can you feel some assistance if you rev the engine.
Do you feel any pulsing through the steering, when stationary.
Do you hear any hissing as you apply lite force to the steering wheel.
Did it go heavy all at once or was there a gradual fall off of power.
In a healthy system there should be a heavy hissing noise from the pump with the steering held hard at full lock either way, this hissing noise comes from the oil being forced through the pressure relief valve in the pump, I doubt very much that you will hear any such sound but try it.
The more information you can give concerning the questions raised might help us to understand the problem better.
Dave
randomx
Posts: 17
Joined: 04 Dec 2002, 02:24
Location: Ireland
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Post by randomx »

Dave
I have checked out your questions, see below :
Is there no power assistance to the steering at all.
--- In my view there is some assistance, while the steering is heavy its not totally rigid. I find that if i turn the steering slowly its not that heavy.
Does it feel the same in both directions.
--- Yes
Can you feel some assistance if you rev the engine.
--- Dont notice much of a difference.
Do you feel any pulsing through the steering, when stationary.
---No, no feedback through the steering.
Do you hear any hissing as you apply lite force to the steering wheel.
-- Yes I can hear a slight hiss.
Did it go heavy all at once or was there a gradual fall off of power.
--- It happened very quickly, over an hour.
In a healthy system there should be a heavy hissing noise from the pump with the steering held hard at full lock either way, this hissing noise comes from the oil being forced through the pressure relief valve in the pump, I doubt very much that you will hear any such sound but try it.
--- Yes, I can hear a heavy hissing when in locked in both directions.
Just to add, its most concerning when driving as when I apply taht extra to overcome the resistance the steering can give a little more than you expect.
I hope this info can help a little.
Thanks again for your help.
Regards Mike.
michael
alexx
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Post by alexx »

Hm, strange...
Did you check the pump belt for slipping? Check, buth with someone else turning the steering wheel.
Edited by - alexx on 10 Dec 2002 10:48:57
Dave Burns
Posts: 1915
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Post by Dave Burns »

Well it would seem the pump and drive belt can be ruled out because of the relief valve venting, but as the oil is apparently going through the steering without doing the work, why does the valve need to vent when at full lock? unless the output from the pump is much greater than the internal leak.
A pinion valve with leaking internal seal is more often worse in one direction than the other, and ought to improve a bit as you rev the engine.
The time frame in which it failed, and your last note <font color=blue>"Just to add, its most concerning when driving as when I apply taht extra to overcome the resistance the steering can give a little more than you expect"</font id=blue>, would lead me to suspect the ram.
I have known a ram go down on a ZX, this produced very dangerous momentary steering lockups when it was being turned in one direction, it had to be turned a fraction in the other direction before it would go any further.
While I can't say for certain it will be the ram, all the evidence points to it and fortunatley is not to difficult to remove.
On the ram I removed from the ZX, expelling the oil then covering both ports with my fingers and forcing the piston in and out revealed its conditon, the ram made no attempt to suck or blow air through the ports covered by my fingers, which meant that air in front of the piston was able to get past the piston seal as it moved down the cylinder.
If you are going to do this yourself, raise and suport the front of the car then turn the steering from lock to lock, engine off, feeling for any stiff or rough movement, if any is noticed remove the ram and try it again.
I would take the car out of service and pinpoint the culprit before purchasing any replacement parts, things sometimes don't turn out as straightforward as they appear, I would eat my hat but it may turn out to be something else alltogether.
Dave
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