Xantia front drops to normal at startup

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Honda
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Xantia front drops to normal at startup

Post by Honda »

Greetings.

A few secs after I start the car, the front drops from a slighty higher than normal position to the normal position, making some noise.
The strange thing is that the front height-corrector is brand new...
What do you think can be causing this? Dirty LHM?

Suspension is non-HA, 6 spheres.

Thanks
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Post by mezuk04 »

When was the Height Corrector replaced?

Did the front end do this before the Corrector was replaced??

How long ago was the fluid and filters (LHM) changed and cleaned???
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Post by Honda »

Thanks for the prompt reply!

- Height corrector was replaced a week ago (Citroen).
- LHM was changed about a year and half ago (did it myself).
- The front end had this behave before but very ocasionally. Now it happens almost every time. When the car is stoped I notice the front is a little too high. When I turn it on it drops to normal.
- Citroen (who changed the HC) also messed with the rear height. I can visually see the rear height is almost an inch lower than it should. I think I will try to fix this myself (just can't trust those Citroen mechanics). Do you know where I can find a photo describing the operation?

Rgrds
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Post by mezuk04 »

The search facility will be very comprehensive in the operation of correcting the height via the Height Correctors, me and my mate did this job on my Xantia so their will be a couple of topics from myself probably.

Others may be able to help you with photos.
Just make sure the car is fully supported, we used car ramps at the back for adjusting the rear HC and then changed them over to the front to adjust the front HC. Then set the car to low so we knew just how much room we had if the car did lower itself to its lowest point, fair amount of room with the ramps, also a couple of jacks in position as an emergency aid (JUST INCASE)

The adjustment is fairly easy, undo the nut of the HC which is attached the antiroll bar running the entire width of the car and rotate the HC (a hammer instrument can come into use, lightly) make sure the car is at normal ride height when doing this....we personally just did it by eye but was a lot better.

Looks as if Citroen has put the front end up to high and now when the car starts it drops itself down to a correct height (i may be slightly off in describing this so may need another opinion)

I know i know my posts go on and on and get confusing but they make sense to me....Honest :lol:
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Post by Peter.N. »

As mezuk says the actual adjustment is easy, its getting the car in the right position that isn't. You ideally need it on a ramp so there is plenty of room to move it up and down without it hitting you on the head. Once you have good clearance under it, slacken the bolt on the clamp around the anti roll bar, and , with the engine running rotate the clamp in the required direction to correct the height but, beware the car will follow any adjustment instantly. I am not sure exactly what the height should be, but if the suspension arms are level, i,e, parralel with the road, it will be about right.
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Post by mezuk04 »

Wow Im right again hehehe....this is happening far too often for my liking.

When I adjusted the HC's the front end was very very very sensitive compared to the rear.....when you do them you may aswell give them a nice clean and soak to get them freely moving....

Wouldnt surprise me if Citroen stuck a big load of glue in them just so you had to return to spend money, any more repairs needed make sure you ask here first before spending money at Citroen :D
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Post by alan s »

I'd be suggesting doing a fluid change and then do a mega bleed via all the brakes.
Did this on my Xantia before I went on a long run recently and was surprised at how much air I bled from a rear brake. Following this, the suspension began behaving, ride improved and strange little tricks like car suddenly dropping suddenly stopped.
If you still have your old height corrector, pull it apart as I'm certain you'll kick yourself for replacing it rather than just doing a DIY clean on it as I was given a lesson on redoing these a couple of days ago and was dumbfounded at just how simple they really are.
My guess is that air has got into the system when the H/C was replaced and this is why I feel a good bleed might make a big difference.



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Post by Honda »

Thanks all for the incisive replies!

I believe you're probably right:
- Citroen dealer let air enter the LHM circuit. (Cure = bleeding)
- They adjusted incorrectly the height. (Cure = new adjustment)
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Re: Xantia front drops to normal at startup

Post by Mandrake »

Honda wrote:Greetings.

A few secs after I start the car, the front drops from a slighty higher than normal position to the normal position, making some noise.
The strange thing is that the front height-corrector is brand new...
What do you think can be causing this? Dirty LHM?

Suspension is non-HA, 6 spheres.

Thanks
If the height drops a bit a few seconds after starting the car, its because the anti-sink valves were closed (which prevent height corrections either up OR down) and opened when the HP pump started topping up the pressure.

But if it was higher than it should have been it means that the anti-sink valves closed before the height corrector had a chance to lower the height the previous time the occupants got out.

Try this test:

Sitting in the car engine idling, if you get out you should see the height of the front and back drop 5-10 seconds later, and if you get in it should rise again. Now turn the engine off and wait 30 seconds or so and THEN get out. Do both ends of the car drop ?

If not, either the accumulator sphere is flat, or something is bleeding away the accumulator pressure reserve quickly enough to cause the anti-sink valve to close before you get a chance to get out of the car.

Regards,
Simon
Simon

1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White

2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
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Post by Mandrake »

alan s wrote:I'd be suggesting doing a fluid change and then do a mega bleed via all the brakes.
Did this on my Xantia before I went on a long run recently and was surprised at how much air I bled from a rear brake. Following this, the suspension began behaving, ride improved and strange little tricks like car suddenly dropping suddenly stopped.
Alan, describe the "sudden dropping" your car does.... It's a Hydractive 2 model, right ?

Do you mean in the morning when its pressurizing that the back will lift, and then while the front is lifting the back will suddenly drop a few inches then lift again ?

If so then I've got some bad news for you... its not caused by air in the system, (although that may exaserbate it) it's caused by one or both of the electrovalves leaking... :(

Either valve leaking causes the same effect as they share the same high pressure supply line - on my car its the front valve that leaks badly and yet its the back that does the sudden dropping.

If you raise yours to full height and after fully pressurizing let it back down to normal height does it also occasionally pop up at both ends like a cork and then drop again ? Same cause.

I've done extensive testing of this problem (and associated intermitant harsh ride that it can cause) and I've proved fairly conclusively that it is the electrovalve leakage that causes both symptoms.

Also the nature of the problem is such that the leakage can vary wildly from day to day, and in fact it can also vary every time the electovalve is switched on and off - for example 1 in 5 times it might be leaky while on and the other 4 times its ok. :evil:

Should be getting my hands on a new electovalve next week and finally solve the problem for good...

By the way I have a relatively simple test you can do to measure the amount of leakage of the electrovalves in the "ON" mode (which is when they seem to leak) which only requires a resistor and a stopwatch... :)

Regards,
Simon
Simon

1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White

2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
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Post by mezuk04 »

Mandrake..not sure if im wrong...wouldnt be the first time hehhee

But in his 1st post he says its non HA.....the standard 6 spheres...unless i know even less than i first thought :lol:
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Post by Mandrake »

mezuk04 wrote:Mandrake..not sure if im wrong...wouldnt be the first time hehhee

But in his 1st post he says its non HA.....the standard 6 spheres...unless i know even less than i first thought :lol:
No you're not wrong, you're just not paying attention :lol:

My first post was in response to Honda's problem...my second one was an off topic response to Alan about a problem he mentioned his own car having...

Regards,
Simon
Simon

1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White

2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
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Post by mezuk04 »

Whoops...so I guess this means I'm not the king.....bugger! :oops:
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Post by Honda »

Just to confim I've solved the problem:
1. Height at front was 1.7cm higher than it should be.
2. Changed LHM with brakes bleeding.

Ride is now perfect with total comfort and there are no suspension movements when starting/stoping the engine.
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