Burst Sphere?

Post by **DHallworth** » 24 Feb 2006, 20:14

I just started my activa, and set the suspension to high to get it off the grass, and i saw steam from under the bonnet, and the suspension didn't move.

I stopped the engine, lifted the bonnet and with a torch i can see that there is LHM Oil all over the engine bay. And the front drivers side sphere is soaking wet, looks like its leaking from the nipple on the front of the sphere.

Anyone else ever experienced this? Also can i just replace the one sphere safely?
Regards
David.

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 24 Feb 2006, 20:21

its unlikly the sphere has poped it is more likly to be the suspension feed pipe fractured
regards malcolm

Post by **Peter.N.** » 24 Feb 2006, 20:23

I have never known of a sphere failing, David, but I suppose there is allways a first time. I would clean the fluid off and then start it again and watch. If it is the sphere, its OK to replace one if the others are in good condition.

dnsey · Post by **dnsey** » 24 Feb 2006, 21:00

If you look for the problem 'under pressure', I'd suggest wearing goggles and gloves. Like injectors, a pinhole with that much pressure behind it would be quite capable of forcing oil through the skin, with potentially lethal results.
Might sound like overkill, but better than 'kill'!

Mandrake · Post by **Mandrake** » 24 Feb 2006, 21:14

Check the feed pipes for cracks first as malcolm suggested, but yes, the filler cap on the end of the sphere CAN leak, it is basically a simple o-ring seal which sits under the shoulder of the bolt sealing against the outer face of the sphere.

It sounds like it has blown that seal, which will have let all the nitrogen out in a big rush, and if oil came through as well that means the diaphram is punctured too, which means the sphere is a writeoff.

I've only ever seen it happen on a regassed accumulator sphere, and its a bit hard to say what the triggering event is.

My theory on this is the seal burst and the sudden decompression of the gas portion of the chamber caused a violent inrush of oil which folded the diaphram back on itself and cracked the diaphram.

How old was that sphere ? Rupturing like this is a freak occurance, but if the sphere was old or has been regassed a few times, I would definately replace its mate as well to be sure.

At the very least it is important that left and right spheres have equal gas pressure for stable handling, and are the same age with the same diaphram material so they lose gas at the same rate, and thus maintain this equal balance of pressure as the spheres age...

Regards,
Simon

BonceChops · Post by **BonceChops** » 25 Feb 2006, 08:22

Peter.N. wrote:If it is the sphere, its OK to replace one if the others are in good condition.

I would only ever change them in pairs. I would have thought if the 2 spheres were at different pressure's, on side could be firmer than the other, it would effect roadhandling

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 25 Feb 2006, 09:30

as simon said fluid will only come out at this point if firstly the blader was split and secondly the seal behind the niple had given up,in which ever order it happend,also its more likly to have a problem with the seal if the sphere has been regased at all.i would still put my dosh on the susp supply pipe
regards malcolm

Post by **DHallworth** » 25 Feb 2006, 21:19

I had a look in daylight today, and sure enough, there is a hole in the nipple at the end of the sphere.

There was a very fine high pressure jet of oil aiming down towards the subframe.

All is well now, got 2 new spheres from GSF this morning. Done both front spheres now.

Lurvly an soft.
Regards
David.

Mandrake · Post by **Mandrake** » 25 Feb 2006, 22:11

Are you sure they're the right spheres ?

I was under the impression that GSF didn't sell spheres for the Activa ?

(Although for front strut spheres, the normal Hydractive 2 ones would probably be close enough at a pinch)

Regards,
Simon

Post by **DHallworth** » 25 Feb 2006, 23:42

i just got 2 normal spheres for the front of a xantia.

God, tell me they're not the wrong ones.

David.

Mandrake · Post by **Mandrake** » 26 Feb 2006, 04:24

DHallworth wrote:i just got 2 normal spheres for the front of a xantia.

God, tell me they're not the wrong ones.

David.

Could be....

The Activa as well as the anti-roll system contains a complete Hydractive 2 system, therefore should not use strut spheres for the "standard" (non-hydractive non-activa) models.

Here is the GSF sphere table:

http://www.gsfcarparts.com/downloads/sphere_table.pdf

Which ones did you get ?

In the Citroen sphere table I have the Hydractive 2 front strut spheres are specified as:

96238949 - multilayer diaphram, 450cc, 45 bars, 0.7mm damper hole

And the Activa front strut spheres are listed as:

96221189 - multilayer diaphram, 450cc, 45 bars, 0.7mm damper hole

EG, different part number, but same specs....

Perhaps the spring washer tension is different. (Not specified in either case)

So if you're unable to get proper Activa ones, (and as I mentioned, I don't think GSF stock the Activa ones at all) the Hydractive 2 ones should be a fairly close match, however the ones off the standard model are not suitable... they have a damper hole of 1.5mm, and you'll find the front suspension floaty and wallowy at speed...

Regards,
Simon

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 26 Feb 2006, 14:44

Mandrake wrote:
DHallworth wrote:i just got 2 normal spheres for the front of a xantia.

God, tell me they're not the wrong ones.

David.
Could be....

The Activa as well as the anti-roll system contains a complete Hydractive 2 system, therefore should not use strut spheres for the "standard" (non-hydractive non-activa) models.

Here is the GSF sphere table:

http://www.gsfcarparts.com/downloads/sphere_table.pdf

Which ones did you get ?

In the Citroen sphere table I have the Hydractive 2 front strut spheres are specified as:

96238949 - multilayer diaphram, 450cc, 45 bars, 0.7mm damper hole

And the Activa front strut spheres are listed as:

96221189 - multilayer diaphram, 450cc, 45 bars, 0.7mm damper hole

EG, different part number, but same specs.... Perhaps the spring washer tension is different. (Not specified in either case)

So if you're unable to get proper Activa ones, (and as I mentioned, I don't think GSF stock the Activa ones at all) the Hydractive 2 ones should be a fairly close match, however the ones off the standard model are not suitable... they have a damper hole of 1.5mm, and you'll find the front suspension floaty and wallowy at speed...

Regards,
Simon

didnt GSF ask you what specific model your car is,as they are usualy on the ball or in this case sphere
regards malcolm

Post by **DHallworth** » 26 Feb 2006, 18:46

erm.... I just asked for 2 front spheres for a xantia.

There was a guy there at the same time asking for two front spheres for an l Reg 2.0 Injection, and they gave us both the same spheres.

The part numbers on the boxes were both the same.

God i hope they aint the wrong ones.

David.

Post by **Peter.N.** » 26 Feb 2006, 23:18

If you had the wrong spheres you would notice a considerable difference in the ride and/or handling, if its OK dont worry. Also, having spheres of different pressures due to aging will alter the ammount of suspension movement but shouldn't adversly affect the drive, assuming that one is not nearly completely flat.