Anyone remember where the BX heater valve overhaul article (by AlanS) is to be found ?
Have minus 7degC here and a rather large heater leakage soaking the carpets in my BX passenger side.
So far got the matrix out and working on the heater valve. I have a spare on stock.
Cheers / Anders
BX heater valve
Moderator: RichardW
BX heater valve
Anders (DK) - '90 BX16Image
I recall the posting you have in mind. I would have thought that it was likely to be on this board - merely on the basis that BX Club is relatively new, and the Citroen Z board is only a couple of years old.
I had a look on Aussiefrogs and found this:
As far as the heater is concerned, if it is anything like the one in my Citroen BX it is hard to believe that is was designed at any time other than just after the PSA christmas party - nobody sober could have done what these fellows did
On mine it is controlled by a bowden cable which is bent in around 240 degree arc. The movement is via a plastic quadrant & the cable "held" in position by a spring clip type of saddle which could not possibly hold it, hence when you turn the knob, the outer cable obviously moves preventing the inner cable from doing it's job. If you pull the dash apart & remove this cable, you have your chance & Buckleys of refitting it back where it came from. If you decide to disconnect from the other end (heater end) then it becomes a major demolition job or a call to the Red Cross to be sure they'll be right to top up your blood supply by the time you get in there & do it.
I have opted to take this cable out of the equation altogether & mount it attached to a lever on the side of the centre console. That way I end up with a straight pull on the cable, have more leverage than is possible from a flimsy plastic quadrant, & can physically see that it is either on or off. I will leave the knob where it is as there is a micro switch in there which I think is to cut out the air/con compressor when the switch is in the warm-hot position. This way when I use the air/con I just make sure that the switch is fully in the "blue."
Regarding you using Mobil 1 - Don't panic, a lot of Pug & Cit owners use it & live to tell the tale
I seem to recall a more detailed article and some photos showing domestic water valves (Red turn handles) and think he bypassed the water valve altogether or used it as a connector and the domestic valve to control things.
Could full article be on 16 valve site?
+ 7.2 and damp here!
jeremy
I had a look on Aussiefrogs and found this:
As far as the heater is concerned, if it is anything like the one in my Citroen BX it is hard to believe that is was designed at any time other than just after the PSA christmas party - nobody sober could have done what these fellows did
On mine it is controlled by a bowden cable which is bent in around 240 degree arc. The movement is via a plastic quadrant & the cable "held" in position by a spring clip type of saddle which could not possibly hold it, hence when you turn the knob, the outer cable obviously moves preventing the inner cable from doing it's job. If you pull the dash apart & remove this cable, you have your chance & Buckleys of refitting it back where it came from. If you decide to disconnect from the other end (heater end) then it becomes a major demolition job or a call to the Red Cross to be sure they'll be right to top up your blood supply by the time you get in there & do it.
I have opted to take this cable out of the equation altogether & mount it attached to a lever on the side of the centre console. That way I end up with a straight pull on the cable, have more leverage than is possible from a flimsy plastic quadrant, & can physically see that it is either on or off. I will leave the knob where it is as there is a micro switch in there which I think is to cut out the air/con compressor when the switch is in the warm-hot position. This way when I use the air/con I just make sure that the switch is fully in the "blue."
Regarding you using Mobil 1 - Don't panic, a lot of Pug & Cit owners use it & live to tell the tale
I seem to recall a more detailed article and some photos showing domestic water valves (Red turn handles) and think he bypassed the water valve altogether or used it as a connector and the domestic valve to control things.
Could full article be on 16 valve site?
+ 7.2 and damp here!
jeremy
jeremy
its on the Aussie Frogs forum i think!
The heater valve is pretty easy to get out, seeing how you have the matrix out, theres a number of bars that you need to disconnect from the heater unit, then disconnect the heater pipes from the engine bay and pull the whole unit through.
The long bar closest to the gear stick pulls out with the black plastic bit its connected too, and with the matrix out you should be able to force it out from behind.
http://www.aussiefrogs.com/snippets/archive.htm
Thats where i thought it was!
The heater valve is pretty easy to get out, seeing how you have the matrix out, theres a number of bars that you need to disconnect from the heater unit, then disconnect the heater pipes from the engine bay and pull the whole unit through.
The long bar closest to the gear stick pulls out with the black plastic bit its connected too, and with the matrix out you should be able to force it out from behind.
http://www.aussiefrogs.com/snippets/archive.htm
Thats where i thought it was!
Tx Vanny -
1) being in LHD lands I have no steering axle or pedal box where the heater valve is - easy peasy - right ?
2) Its a turbo - ya remember access to the heater hoses behind engine
- easy peasy - NOT ?
3) That aussiefrog link does not hold the article either
Its getting really fun
1) being in LHD lands I have no steering axle or pedal box where the heater valve is - easy peasy - right ?
2) Its a turbo - ya remember access to the heater hoses behind engine
- easy peasy - NOT ?3) That aussiefrog link does not hold the article either
Its getting really fun
Anders (DK) - '90 BX16Image
when i did it the other day at Cavmads, i found even after i had taken the bolts out i still couldn't seperate the valve from the lower half of the piping so ended up taking the whole lot out.
I'm aware the link didnt give the actual instructions but i'm guessing it must be around there somewhere and might be a good place to start, then found you'd already asked! I wonder if it was on the Jap site?
As for space behind the engine, you presummably dont have the doseur valve or clutch/accel cables down there either so i'd have thought it even easier than here. Take the intercooler off and you should have mor ethan enough room, unless you dont have skinny little girlie arms like me
Some more info here!
http://www.tramontana.co.hu/citroen/coo ... ating.html
I'm aware the link didnt give the actual instructions but i'm guessing it must be around there somewhere and might be a good place to start, then found you'd already asked! I wonder if it was on the Jap site?
As for space behind the engine, you presummably dont have the doseur valve or clutch/accel cables down there either so i'd have thought it even easier than here. Take the intercooler off and you should have mor ethan enough room, unless you dont have skinny little girlie arms like me
Some more info here!
http://www.tramontana.co.hu/citroen/coo ... ating.html
Last edited by vanny on 15 Jan 2006, 23:19, edited 1 time in total.
You're right Malcolm.
- except you forget that 2 of these 4 small bolt holes contains a tubular rivet holding the valve together. Easy peasy to drill out on the workbench. But not in-situ
Now I got that far I'm sure I find a solution. Seems my smaller battery drill can do it using a short drill bit.
Vanny
I really dont want to dismantle all those bits - especially not the turbo. Dont have the doseur right there I know - but still I'm sure you wont call it an easy peasy one
Story continues monday.
- except you forget that 2 of these 4 small bolt holes contains a tubular rivet holding the valve together. Easy peasy to drill out on the workbench. But not in-situ
Now I got that far I'm sure I find a solution. Seems my smaller battery drill can do it using a short drill bit.
Vanny
I really dont want to dismantle all those bits - especially not the turbo. Dont have the doseur right there I know - but still I'm sure you wont call it an easy peasy one
Story continues monday.
Anders (DK) - '90 BX16Image
Anders - I expect you've solved it by now but I did come accross these photos on Bob Smith's site.
http://www.rwbsmith.plus.com/citroen2/H ... 0Valve.jpg
http://www.rwbsmith.plus.com/citroen2/H ... 0Valve.jpg
jeremy
Why would you need to dismantle the turbo? Personally i can connect up the pipes with only the intercooler off, and i have all the added joys of the doseur valve and accociated plumbing, and fancy braided pipe which im convinced are more flexible than that of plain rubber!
For me it would have to be better than wrestling with the pedal box (which remind me i need to tighten one of my bolts up on that!), certainly fram tinkering the other day i found it VERY hard to split the valve, especially since once its connected from the heater matrix there is very little holding it in place bar a single piece of rubber!
For me it would have to be better than wrestling with the pedal box (which remind me i need to tighten one of my bolts up on that!), certainly fram tinkering the other day i found it VERY hard to split the valve, especially since once its connected from the heater matrix there is very little holding it in place bar a single piece of rubber!
vanny you might need to take off the alternatorvanny wrote:Why would you need to dismantle the turbo? Personally i can connect up the pipes with only the intercooler off, and i have all the added joys of the doseur valve and accociated plumbing, and fancy braided pipe which im convinced are more flexible than that of plain rubber!
For me it would have to be better than wrestling with the pedal box (which remind me i need to tighten one of my bolts up on that!), certainly fram tinkering the other day i found it VERY hard to split the valve, especially since once its connected from the heater matrix there is very little holding it in place bar a single piece of rubber!
regards malcolm
Right -
Thanks very much keeping me hot on the job guys
Yes J hat is the images I remember. What I didnt remember was that they only show the function - no details.
The valve is in fact a very good construction : basically a slide valve - with slider and base in ceramic composite material. A brilliant construction known from bathroom taps - as they never sticks, leaks or wear if kept wetted by water.
Most problems solved now.
I removed the bolt that holds the valve to the heater box and unhooked the 2 linkages. The valve is then free to move only held by the flexible rubber heater hoses. That was exactly what was needed to drill out the 2 rivets.
With the valve out the problem became evident :
2 circular seals (against the matrix flange) had detoriated by age. The rubber was compressed and brittle. After cleaning and drying the valve body - traces of calcium clearly showed the leak paths.
In fact the matrix was not that bad as I thought in the first place. Only a smallish seep leakage was found. It clearly was the valve seals at gross fault.
BTW : just for the record on later searches :
If you decide to replace a BX heater matrix you will also need to replace those 2 seals mentioned above. They comes in a kit (a set of 2) :
gasket kit ens-diam 20x24 e 3.3 - 95 610 724
Me thinks they are Viton by the looks & feeling. The description above translates to : Square section circular seal, outer dia 24, inner dia 20, height 3.3 mm.
heater matrix - 95 495 316
PS : there is no other reason to remove and disassemble the valve as I did (drilled out rivets) - unless it is clear that its leaking at the square seal against the heater hose flange - or at the control rod seal. The valve unit is NOT available as spare.
Thanks very much keeping me hot on the job guys
Yes J hat is the images I remember. What I didnt remember was that they only show the function - no details.
The valve is in fact a very good construction : basically a slide valve - with slider and base in ceramic composite material. A brilliant construction known from bathroom taps - as they never sticks, leaks or wear if kept wetted by water.
Most problems solved now.
I removed the bolt that holds the valve to the heater box and unhooked the 2 linkages. The valve is then free to move only held by the flexible rubber heater hoses. That was exactly what was needed to drill out the 2 rivets.
With the valve out the problem became evident :
2 circular seals (against the matrix flange) had detoriated by age. The rubber was compressed and brittle. After cleaning and drying the valve body - traces of calcium clearly showed the leak paths.
In fact the matrix was not that bad as I thought in the first place. Only a smallish seep leakage was found. It clearly was the valve seals at gross fault.
BTW : just for the record on later searches :
If you decide to replace a BX heater matrix you will also need to replace those 2 seals mentioned above. They comes in a kit (a set of 2) :
gasket kit ens-diam 20x24 e 3.3 - 95 610 724
Me thinks they are Viton by the looks & feeling. The description above translates to : Square section circular seal, outer dia 24, inner dia 20, height 3.3 mm.
heater matrix - 95 495 316
PS : there is no other reason to remove and disassemble the valve as I did (drilled out rivets) - unless it is clear that its leaking at the square seal against the heater hose flange - or at the control rod seal. The valve unit is NOT available as spare.
Anders (DK) - '90 BX16Image
Anders, did you find my response on Aussiefrogs I made to your posting??
At present I'm not around much as I am in the middle of a restoration on a BX Estate, just finished a full repaint on a Lancer as well as an Mi16 engine rebuild and living as I do on acres in a heatwave (most days outside temp between 36 & 43) I have a full time job keeping the grasses under control or we end up with snakes for bedmates.
As a result I'm not on the 'puter much at present and tend to miss a fair bit.
Alan S
At present I'm not around much as I am in the middle of a restoration on a BX Estate, just finished a full repaint on a Lancer as well as an Mi16 engine rebuild and living as I do on acres in a heatwave (most days outside temp between 36 & 43) I have a full time job keeping the grasses under control or we end up with snakes for bedmates.
As a result I'm not on the 'puter much at present and tend to miss a fair bit.Alan S
RIP Sept 19th 2008.
She said "Put the cat out" She didn't mention it was on fire!!
She said "Put the cat out" She didn't mention it was on fire!!
AndersDK wrote:Yeah I missed it
Thanks reminding me
But it was not that article I'm afraid. Thanks anyway.
I'm in the process of finding a new set of seals to go with the "new" matrix.
Refitting should be a very easy peasy reversal of removing ...
I think some of these guys are forgetting that they have a set of pedals and a steering wheel where you don't too!!
Alan S
RIP Sept 19th 2008.
She said "Put the cat out" She didn't mention it was on fire!!
She said "Put the cat out" She didn't mention it was on fire!!