ZX rear Anti-Roll bar up-grade ??

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sooty
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ZX rear Anti-Roll bar up-grade ??

Post by sooty »

Is there an upgrade (stiffer) for the rear anti-roll bar for the ZX hatchback.??

If so where can they be found, and has anyone changed theirs.
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rossnunn
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Post by rossnunn »

the only 'upgrade' I know about is the 16v / Volcane standard ones. Other than that it might be worth looking down the Pug 306 route
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AlWilliams
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Post by AlWilliams »

I belive that the A.R. bars on the Volcane are 2mm thicker (?), but I can't remember where I heard it.

Anyway, in my Volcane I changed the ARB bushes in the summer, a pig of a job with no room to move. :evil:

I can only recommend that you have plenty of time and tools to hand if you wish to upgrade yours, from memory there are several large parts of car getting in the way of a removal / refitting. It's hard enough just moving the bar enough to replace the rubbers.

Hope I haven't rained on you parade to much, I bet someone out there knows a few short cuts. :wink:
Good luck.


Doh! Rear not front :oops:
Last edited by AlWilliams on 01 Dec 2005, 16:18, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by RichardW »

Not sure why you'd want to change the ARB on a ZX - they were set up at the factory with neutral handling, which should serve in most cases, unless you like having the arse hanging out...

What is more likely is that the rear subframe mounts are shagged, and this is causing the back end to sqirm about on corners. See a post by me a few weeks ago about changing the mounts - it made a huge difference to the handling of our ZX. Another possibilty is that the ARB mounting bracket bolt has been sheared off - I managed to do this on our previous one changing a brake pipe - but didn't realise that's what it was - I just thought it was the handbrake bracket, till I read the Haynes later on :oops: That really did make the rear squirm about....

I seem the remember that the rear ARB runs through the middle of the axle tube, so replacing it is going to be awkward - the best bet, if the Volcane does indeed have stiffer ARBs, might be to source a rear axle off one of those, and fit that, which would also give you rear discs; mind you, you'd need to lower the front with Volcane springs too, otherwise it would be a bit 'nose up' :?
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rossnunn
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Post by rossnunn »

I thought the 16v used a thicker ARB than the Volcane? :?

I have the rear mounts go on my ZX, never noticed a differance, until that is I changed them, rear felt much tighter :P
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sooty
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Post by sooty »

Thanks for your replies,
but one of the reasons of up-grading the rear AR is to reduce the inner front wheel lift when cornering.

Because of the increased torque from boosting etc, I find I loose traction when cornering with wheel spin.

The rear sub mounts where renewed not so long ago.
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Post by AlWilliams »

In a front wheel drive car, virtually everyone will loose drive when pushing on, it doesn't take much shift in weight to allow the inner wheel to spin (something i'm very used to). One of the benefits of a std differential. :wink:

To help minimise this, there are two options that spring to mind:

1) A limited slip dif designed for a 306 should hopefully fit your ZX box. Not cheap, but I know it makes a hell of a difference in a 306.

2) Uprate your front suspension componenets to reduce body lean, beefing up the rear will help but working on the front will probably deliver more benefit with less complexity (uprated rear shocks will help as well).
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Post by sooty »

If I go back to my days with up-rated MK2 1600 escorts.
Being that they are RWD, to reduce roll as you say, you would stiffen the front, but not too stiff on the back otherwise you'll lift the inner wheel and lose traction. Thats why you'd see them lifting a front inner wheel when racing on a track.

But with FWD its the opposite, you'd see most lift a rear inner wheel. So if the front is too stiffen as you suggest, then I'll be worse off.

I've notice that some low powered cars/vans, you can spin the wheels easier than others even with a 150/175bhp td without LSD. (Part of my job driving various types of vehicles)
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Post by __CA__ »

There's an interesting article here about modifying FWD suspension systems - it's aimed at the 206 but the principles are the same for all PSA cars running struts at the front and torsion bars at the rear. Interesting to note how many people stiffen the front but do nothing to the rear except lowering it. The result might look good but the balance of the car will tend even more towards understeer. Still, probably doesn't matter when most of these cars spend their time in MacDonald's car parks :wink:

To answer the original question, there are Peugeot Sport rally parts available here in the UK or direct from Peugeot Sport in France (prices are in Euros) here

You will note they are not cheap! So you'll probably be best to find a Volcane or 16v one. I would be very interested to know if anyone has a list of torsion bar and anti roll bar thicknesses used for each model. Would the workshop manual have this?
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Post by rossnunn »

first link is a interesting read.
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Post by robsons »

If you uprate the front roll bar you'll get MORE wheel lift!

The reason the wheel lifts is because the front two wheels are linked together by the roll bar. The stiffer the bar the more they'll move together. If the rear of the car is softer than the front the back end will lean and pull the front with it. As the roll bar is there at the front it will resist the roll by "effectively" pulling up the non loaded wheel. In extremes it will lift it. (Yes we all get that and loads of wheelspin). A bigger roll bar will cause this to happen earlier.

NOTE that a this also has the side effect of reducing the grip at the front and adding MORE OVERSTEER - Don't do it without playing with the back too (Very difficult so leave it alone)
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Post by Mandrake »

robsons wrote: NOTE that a this also has the side effect of reducing the grip at the front and adding MORE OVERSTEER - Don't do it without playing with the back too (Very difficult so leave it alone)
Don't you mean more understeer ? :)

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sooty
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Post by sooty »

robsons wrote:If you uprate the front roll bar you'll get MORE wheel lift!

The reason the wheel lifts is because the front two wheels are linked together by the roll bar. The stiffer the bar the more they'll move together. If the rear of the car is softer than the front the back end will lean and pull the front with it. As the roll bar is there at the front it will resist the roll by "effectively" pulling up the non loaded wheel. In extremes it will lift it. (Yes we all get that and loads of wheelspin). A bigger roll bar will cause this to happen earlier.

NOTE that a this also has the side effect of reducing the grip at the front and adding MORE OVERSTEER - Don't do it without playing with the back too (Very difficult so leave it alone)

If you read my first post above, you'll see I had intension of altering the front suspension.! :?
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