Xantia 1.9TD Clatter

marpate1 · Post by **marpate1** » 06 Nov 2005, 18:55

Hello,

Having replaced the crankshaft pulley and installing a new timing belt, the engine clattered really badly. I couldn't find the flywheel locking hole when I tried to install the belt first time so put car in gear and applied handbrake to lock the engine - did not work well.

I then adjusted the timing belt again after locking flywheel, cam and fuel pump and the engine sounded better than ever. But, having covered a handful of miles, it is clattery on idle.

Any ideas of what this could be? Does the timing belt tensioner have to be reset on a hot engine?

Any advice welcomed.

Mark

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 07 Nov 2005, 09:15

the tension dose not usualy have to be reset if you set it at the right tension in the first place,did you run engine after the first atempt,because you must not move the crack,cam or pump sprocket at all whilst the belt is removed as you risk causing damage to the valves,and as you can not lock the cranck enough by putting car in gear with hand brake on,the cranck has to be locked solid,so even if the car seemed to run beter you may have slightly bent the some of the valves
regards malcolm

marpate1 · Post by **marpate1** » 07 Nov 2005, 09:21

citronut wrote:the tension dose not usualy have to be reset if you set it at the right tension in the first place,did you run engine after the first atempt,because you must not move the crack,cam or pump sprocket at all whilst the belt is removed as you risk causing damage to the valves,and as you can not lock the cranck enough by putting car in gear with hand brake on,the cranck has to be locked solid,so even if the car seemed to run beter you may have slightly bent the some of the valves
regards malcolm

Hi Malcolm,

The engine wasn't turned over at all with the belt removed. After the first attempt (which sounded like a tractor), I checked the belt again and the fuel pump was 1 tooth advanced. It's reset now and the clatter is not too bad - it's just that it sounded perfect initially.

I may just loosen the tensioner again to see if it takes up any more slack.

As an aside, how much kick should the turbo give? I feel nothing different in acceleration and wonder if I have another gremlin to sort out.

Thanks,
Mark

Post by **Peter.N.** » 07 Nov 2005, 09:22

No, the timing belt does not have to be adjusted with a hot engine, did the auto adjuster take up all the slack, only sometimes they stick and require a little assistance from a large screwdriver. It should be 'tight' its difficult to describe how tight but certainly tighter than the average auxilliary belt, almost to the point that you can play a tune on it!

If you hadn't said that you had all the timimg pegs in, I would have said that the camshaft was one tooth out, thats the only reason I can think,of to cause a 'mechanical' clatter, as the valves hit the pistons! If it is a combustion 'knock' it could be that the pump is advanced by one tooth.

If you dont peg the crankshaft, which I know is not easy, it can easily move a tooth when you take the slack up.

JohnD · Post by **JohnD** » 07 Nov 2005, 11:00

Peter.N. wrote:
If you hadn't said that you had all the timimg pegs in, I would have said that the camshaft was one tooth out, .

That would be my guess as well. I speak from experience - the first time I ever did an XUD got 1 tooth out and it sounded like a tractor.

marpate1 · Post by **marpate1** » 07 Nov 2005, 11:43

JohnD wrote:
Peter.N. wrote:
If you hadn't said that you had all the timimg pegs in, I would have said that the camshaft was one tooth out, .
That would be my guess as well. I speak from experience - the first time I ever did an XUD got 1 tooth out and it sounded like a tractor.

Don't get me wrong - it's really not that bad.

I just don't understand how it was quiet initially and started to clatter after a short while. The clatter is not excessive and it certainly not valve/piston damage.

Cheers,
Mark

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 07 Nov 2005, 19:06

the belt should be tentioned so if you grip the forward long straight of belt between your forfinger and thumb,you should only be able to twist the flat quarter of a turn,so if it twists more than this its to loose,and if it wont twist at all or not by this amount its to tight,it doose need to be just about right,and if you dont fit all the locking pins somthing will move out of line,it is that critical,even if you think it did not move on your first atempt
regards malcolm

yangreen · Post by **yangreen** » 07 Nov 2005, 21:52

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As an aside, how much kick should the turbo give? I feel nothing different in acceleration and wonder if I have another gremlin to sort out.

As you have a TD, you should get a noticeable kick at around 2000rpm under heavyish throttle. Gentle acceleration won't get the turbo going.

Ian

marpate1 · Post by **marpate1** » 08 Nov 2005, 08:27

yangreen wrote:
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As an aside, how much kick should the turbo give? I feel nothing different in acceleration and wonder if I have another gremlin to sort out. 
As you have a TD, you should get a noticeable kick at around 2000rpm under heavyish throttle. Gentle acceleration won't get the turbo going.

Ian

Hi Ian,

I don't notice anything at all under any conditions

. I'll have a search through the archives to try and find more info on this.

Thanks,
Mark

marpate1 · Post by **marpate1** » 08 Nov 2005, 08:29

citronut wrote:the belt should be tentioned so if you grip the forward long straight of belt between your forfinger and thumb,you should only be able to twist the flat quarter of a turn,so if it twists more than this its to loose,and if it wont twist at all or not by this amount its to tight
regards malcolm

Hi Malcolm,

Many thanks - I will take a look at this again at the weekend. The car is running very well (except for the turbo).

Cheers,
Mark

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 08 Nov 2005, 08:55

if the turbo was working and now is not,then you may have left off intercooler pipes or not done the jubile clips up,if its sucking air the turbo wont work
regards malcolm

marpate1 · Post by **marpate1** » 08 Nov 2005, 09:32

citronut wrote:if the turbo was working and now is not,then you may have left off intercooler pipes or not done the jubile clips up,if its sucking air the turbo wont work
regards malcolm

Hi Malcolm,

I'm not sure that the turbo has ever worked (only had the car 6 months).

Thanks,
Mark

jeremy · Post by **jeremy** » 08 Nov 2005, 12:30

I think you'd have disposed of it by now if the turbo didn't work. It would be very slow - I speak from experience with a ZX 1.9D which is of course about 250 kg lighter and pulls a shorter 5th gear. Whilst the Zx will hum along very nicely it is not something you want to start overtaking up motorway hills with. I also have a BX TD Estate - and the difference is very noticeable - it simply surges up steep hills in 4th or 5th.