Access to radiator fans on aircon Xantia

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citronut
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Post by citronut »

you dont need to remove front of car,unless you like doing jobs the long way round,i have done three cars my way just needs bit of percy whatsit,you also dont need to get at wires as the plugs are atached to other side of front panle to the motors and they stay in position regards malcolm
D.Slatford
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Post by D.Slatford »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by citronut</i>

you dont need to remove front of car,unless you like doing jobs the long way round,i have done three cars my way just needs bit of percy whatsit,you also dont need to get at wires as the plugs are atached to other side of front panle to the motors and they stay in position regards malcolm
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I'd like to know your secret, if you've done this on aircon cars! I went round some scrappys today, didn't find any good quality motors, but did get to examine the construction inside and out. The condenser rests immediately behind the motor fixings, sitting in the same plastic housing and fastened to one side by bolts that appear only accessible with the bumper removed. Madness.
Still, my immediate challenge is to find some newish motors before I dismantle anything.
andycarter
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Post by andycarter »

I've done one of these... [:)]
It is possible to detach the blade from the fan motor and remove it through the grille, the centre screw is left hand thread. However if you go this way it still remains to undo the 3 M6 nuts holding the motor in, I think the condensor might prevent you getting a socket on the back.
When I did mine I drained and moved the radiator back, leaving bottom hose connected (because it looked tricky), removed intercooler, detached condenser from mountings & detached drier bottle from mountings - this way there is just enough movement on the hoses to get your hand down in front of the condenser & undo those nuts.
The condeser is fixed with a couple of socket head capscrews next to the a/c pipe connections, be careful to remove the right ones!. I didn't need to use a jack as mentioned previously.
I also removed battery tray airbox headlights etc just to be able to see what was where, it was a while back & I don't rememer the exact sequence - but I did post it on this forum at the time and a search may yield something.
Hope this helps
Andy
alan s
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Post by alan s »

I have also seen them removed by drilling the rivet like head off the bolt that holds the fan motor to the spider it's mounted on and replacing it when refitted, but for my money I still think the longest route is by far the best given the potential for a disaster along the way.
Still obviously can't talk you into just throwing a set of carbon brushes in hey? Done that way at least you know how long they'll last; second hand ones are always going to be an unknown commodity.
Alan S[?]
D.Slatford
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Post by D.Slatford »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by alans</i>


Still obviously can't talk you into just throwing a set of carbon brushes in hey? Done that way at least you know how long they'll last; second hand ones are always going to be an unknown commodity.
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I'll happily replace the brushes if you can point me to anywhere that may sell them :)
Makes sense to me to obtain a couple of second hand motors anyway but replace the brushes in those, so I have a known good pair of motors and the jobs a direct replacement, rather than risk mucking up the only motors I have with the car in pieces.
I've also been pointed to these guys, who may do a suitable replacement: http://www.s-v-c.co.uk/SVCFANS.HTML
alan s
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Post by alan s »

With you having access to much cheaper used fans than we do, I agree, but as I say, if you have a fan from an air/con car, chances are it's almost to its "used by" date.
I can't figure how you guys have so much strife getting these parts (brushes).
Over here we can pick them up from any Auto electrician or even from parts suppliers as they are a genuine spare part.
I have suggested in the past that perhaps GSF or a similar type of place that sells Valeo parts should be able to supply them. I bought carbon brushes for 3 different motors in recent times from 3 different suppliers in two different towns that's how easy they are to get here. I reckon if you find who can supply, they can expect an upsurge in business.[:D]
Alan S
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Post by john alexander »

I've just replaced a fan on a xantia 1.9 td air con ,heres how I did it . removed indicators,front grill,2 bolts on top of lock panel, lif up clips on radiator,take 10mm 1/4 drive socket and saw 5 mm off hex end ,drill hole through other end so that drill can be used as a toggle bar .This just fits between fan and air con rad.Its still a nightmare though regards john.
citronut
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Post by citronut »

as i said earlier i have done this job on air/con xantias through grill opening,without removing any thing elss,yes i know its tight but when fan is of and motor bolts are removed motor comes out forwards,so its easier than you think just tight for space,theres that percy whatsit again regards malcolm
citronut
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Post by citronut »

looked at fans i have in my workshop today,they are not desined to come apart,will not be easy to put brushes in,i did also test the two i have off the car one is has very noisy the other is fine,i do have two on a car i am breaking regards malcolm
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Post by ghostrider »

Citronut,
I think that there are connectors right up at the fan end which was where my problem was, unless mine has been modded, which come to think of it may make some sense.
Alan, I seem to remember that the motors here are crimped together rather than bolted, I did the job on a BX fan once, but you get the impression that they are considered "consummable" I used to use a nice old guy to rewind magnetos and dynamos on my old BSAs and Triumphs, but most of those sort of people with both the knowledge and expertise are sadly no longer with us now, we belong to a throwawy society where those sort of skills are derided as "manual labour" apart from those of us who appreciate and envy such talents
Pete
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Last edited by ghostrider on 22 Feb 2011, 06:06, edited 1 time in total.
citronut
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Post by citronut »

yes pete may be,one of cars i have done was a Preg 1.9TD xant with air/con,i also had an old boy i used for starter and alternator repaires who popt his clogs very incosiderat regards malcolm
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Post by alan s »

Pete,
The ends are held on by spreading the ends of the lugs with what would seem to be a cold chisel mark at about 1/4 and again at 3/4 the width of the lugs.
If a punch with a good face is held in a vice firmly and the end of the lug held side on onto the punch face edge and another punch used to stike the leu at aeach end, it will push the spalayed ends in far enough for them to be tapped through the end plate with a smallet punch.
On reassembly, the ends need to be sat on a solid surface like a vice, and the lugs again splayed out via the old marks using a reasonably sharp but small offset cold chisel or a centre punch.
Nowhere near as hard as it may at first seem. If I was getting A$100 a motor to do them up, I reckon I'd order a new C6 on the potential income as I reckon once set up, I could do a dozen a day.
Alan S[:D]
citronut
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Post by citronut »

time must be cheaper in aus then alan or you have more spare time regards malcolm
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Post by ghostrider »

Alan, that's the way I did it, just occasionally one of those damn lugs breaks off and for the life of me I can't remember the work round, I'm off to have a rummage in the garage to see if I can find the one I fixed "just in case" to see how I did it, mind you over here salt from the roads corroding the bearings solid during the fan's 10 month rest period (Winter to you [:D] [:D] [:D] [:D] ) is more likely to be the cause of failure and considerable damage to the wiring the first time they try to run, as all the connectors will have rotted as well allowing just enough current to incinerate the wiring but not enough to blow the fuse [:D] [:D] [:D]
Pete
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Last edited by ghostrider on 22 Feb 2011, 06:07, edited 1 time in total.
splat
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Post by splat »

I had to replace both fans a couple of years ago. From what I recall I removed the slam panel as well as the bumper, grille, indicators and headlamps. After that you have easy access to the bolts holding the frame that the two fans are mounted on allowing you to remove the whole thing. It sounds like a lot of work but it's actually easy as all the bolts are easily accessible except for the two side bumper fixings. You get to those through the oval covers in the wheelarch liners, unfortunately one of my covers was missing meaning I had to hacksaw off the badly corroded nut. I never bothered replacing the bolt, doesn't seem to matter much.
The whole design is a bit stupid for those of us who live where there's snow - my fan motors burned out after pressing on through snowdrifts on the way home one night. The fans get jammed full of impacted snow, this blocks air flow through the radiator sandwich so the temperature goes up (in spite of it being minus something or other outside), the fans try to cut in and it's all over. The first few times it happened the fuses blew, but I guess the motors can only stand being stalled a few times.
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