Citroen wheel security bolts

This is the Forum for all your Citroen Technical Questions, Problems or Advice.

Moderator: RichardW

ActivaV6uk
Posts: 648
Joined: 20 Nov 2003, 17:51

Citroen wheel security bolts

Post by ActivaV6uk » 21 Jun 2005, 23:52

Firstly I would like to say that if I ever find the designer of them he will be in for a severe beating which its doubtful he will survive.
if you own an Activa or other high speck Xantia (V6 exclusive, HDi 110 exclusive, 2.1 Exclusive or CT estate) you probably know what I’m talking about, these are Citroens anti theft devices for alloy wheels they are a 4 pin coded tool and a set of 4 bolts that you should find one of in each wheel. The problem with them is that the pins used to undo the bolts are made of plastacene and the bolts can become difficult to remove when tightened properly but when you have some one with an air tool fit one you soon find that your 4 pin tool becomes a no pin tool.
So has any one got a method for removing these bolts when the tool is dead? or any one who can re manufacture the tool out of quality materials? There is no point in going to Citroen they give you a tool for £25 that is just as weak as the original and you can break as many of them as you want with out getting the bolt out...
Before I cut the Activa alloy wheel off with a gas axe any help that people can give would be much appreciated.
Andy

Richard Green

Post by Richard Green » 22 Jun 2005, 00:04

hammer a tight socket on to it or you can buy a proper tool that takes them off
http://images.google.co.uk/images?biw=& ... ctor&hl=en
I agree with you on the type they use, they are cheap and nasty plus they always break the pins off.

patneenan
Posts: 75
Joined: 12 Apr 2005, 22:49

Post by patneenan » 22 Jun 2005, 00:15

What a coincidence!
Last night I tried to get my newly changed wheel off and guess what?
Yes, the studs on the anti theft adaptor all twisted.
So this morning back to mechanic ,who torqued it up too much ,to play my face and he is going to repair it.
So tomorrow I'll let you know how I got on

PowerLee
Posts: 1256
Joined: 01 May 2004, 19:49

Post by PowerLee » 22 Jun 2005, 00:37

The 4 pin Citroen / Peugeot anti theft bolts are very good, Its the monkey metal keys that come with them that are the problem.
The later splined anti theft bolts that replaced the 4 pin versions are not even worth fitting to a car, They are so easy to remove without the key.

User avatar
Kowalski
Posts: 2557
Joined: 15 Oct 2003, 17:41

Post by Kowalski » 22 Jun 2005, 01:36

I've got the 4 pin type bolts on my Xantia too, they are probably the most secure setup I've seen on any car.
They're pretty deep set into the wheel and there isn't really enough space to get one of those sockets with the left handed screw thread on is there? Next option would be to try a hammer and chisel, but its down a hole so that'll be a no go too. How about knocking a socket on? Well the outside of the is round, so again no go.
There are two options I can see working, one is possible the other is destructive.
The first method, (if you have an arc welder, MIG and TIG won't go down the hole) you might be able to weld a nut onto the bolt head, its down a hole so I can't see it being easy but its a maybe. The second method would be to drill the head off the bolt. Centre puch it and start with a small drill and work your way up to a bigger one, there is a captive washer on the bolt, so you'll have some margin for error before you start drilling into your alloy wheels.
There isn't an easy or nice solution open to you but thats a good thing because it means the average tea leaf isn't going to have it easy either.

PowerLee
Posts: 1256
Joined: 01 May 2004, 19:49

Post by PowerLee » 22 Jun 2005, 01:53

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Kowalski</i>

I've got the 4 pin type bolts on my Xantia too, they are probably the most secure setup I've seen on any car.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I too rate these security bolts very highly, Its a real shame the keys are made out of monkey metal & the pins snap off.
You wont get these locking bolts of in a hurry, Your wheels are very safe.

goldfinche
Posts: 128
Joined: 08 Jan 2005, 03:29

Post by goldfinche » 22 Jun 2005, 02:36

Hi Some time ago it was possible to get "spark erosion rods" that basically was used with an arc or stick welder. These were used to remove broken off studs etc from engine/castings blocks without damage to the blocks.
Just a thought.
Cheers
Geoff

bxbodger
Posts: 1455
Joined: 23 May 2003, 03:34
x 1

Post by bxbodger » 22 Jun 2005, 04:16

I once had a car with minilites on that were secured with what were known in the seventies as 'Barry nuts'-these were a similar type of thing, one on each wheel, which required a special socket.
The bloke I bought the car off couldn't find the socket so I ended up centre punching each one and slowly drilling each one out enough to get a big stud extractor in-it worked but took ages!!!
It was before I had a MIG- I don't suppose you could weld a normal big bolt on could you??

Richard Green

Post by Richard Green » 22 Jun 2005, 05:04

no matter how secure they are the thief can buy the tool to remove them "if the wheels are worth it" to him, a locking nut is a deterrent to the quick thief not to a determined one, I personally dont rate them because of the cheap way they are made and how easy they are damaged but saying that in most cases its down to over tightening in the first place what does the damage and tyre fitters are the biggest culprit because they use air tool to nip them up and dont set it up to the torque setting for each car plus I have yet to see any of them copperslip the bolts before refitting them, and did you know they should be undone every 1,000 miles and re-torqued because the wheels are alloy in most cases and its a safety factor which most people dont even know of, as for the security bolts it to each their own and down to cost, there are much better ones on the market and its down to how much cost wise and how much you value the alloys at but at the end of the day its better to have them than none at all.

Stempy
Posts: 1626
Joined: 27 Feb 2004, 00:21

Post by Stempy » 22 Jun 2005, 11:36

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Richard Green</i>

I have yet to see any of them copperslip the bolts before refitting them
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I've always been under the impression that you should never put any kind of lubricant on wheel bolt threads, they should be clean and dry.

User avatar
Kowalski
Posts: 2557
Joined: 15 Oct 2003, 17:41

Post by Kowalski » 22 Jun 2005, 15:12

Dry threads are not good, especially when you get a flat tyre and you end up jumping up and down on the end of a short wheel brace and still you can't get the nuts to budge...

rossnunn
Posts: 1254
Joined: 09 Aug 2003, 03:00

Post by rossnunn » 22 Jun 2005, 15:17

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I've always been under the impression that you should never put any kind of lubricant on wheel bolt threads, they should be clean and dry.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I always use a little copperslip on the wheel bolts. Makes life soo much easier, I do them up by hand, then quater turn each one with a cracker bar, then after a few days / miles I just go round & check them again, 99.99 percent of the time they are fine.
My brother, many many mooons ago, had a xr3i that he wanted the alloys off, they have a similar 4 peg design, we got round that by weilding a nut to each locking wheel bolt & using a air gun to 'rattle' them out.
Again it worked but took ages!