Xantia Diesel Cutting out under load

tone depear · Post by **tone depear** » 08 May 2005, 19:51

'noon all
I've had a Xantia 1.9d (non turbo) for a couple of months, and put 4k miles on it with no major hassles. However on holiday in the lakes last week, it seems to have developed a bit of a gremlin. And I suspect it's mar lady's fault. (I'm only writing that cos she's reading over my shoulder!)
Anyway, she was having her first go at driving, and managed to stall it. I know diesel's don't stall, but a bit of brake down but clutch riding free action in a first driving lesson style managed to achieve it. No blame really. Anyway, it stalled. Not having had a diesel before, I don't know if this matters or not, or even if it's related, but now, whenever I put my foot down past about 3/4 travel on the loud pedal, the engine cuts out completely and leaves me coasting until I either stop and start again, or dip the clutch and turn it off and on again. Not ideal, (going up hills on the motorway!) or particularly safe. (no brakes, hard steering...) It just dies, and I can't really explain it. And it seems to be getting worse. I'm home now, so I'm in a position to fix it. Any suggestions at all what could be the matter? It may well need a service, but I just don't know enough about diesels to think of other things that could be causing the problem, and I don't know if it's just coinicidence that it's only happened since the driving lesson...
Any help massively appreciated. Thanks in advance.
- tone

oilyspanner · Post by **oilyspanner** » 08 May 2005, 19:56

I would follow the wiring loom from the engine to where it joins the main loom, not completely sure where that lives on a Xantia but it sounds like you have partly pulled a connector off, probaly when the engine jumped around on its mountings when stalled, just look around pulling and pushing connectors, one will move together I hope.
Stewart

JohnT · Post by **JohnT** » 08 May 2005, 23:52

Check your filter to see if it has collapsed thereby partially blocking the air intake. After it has stalled next time (if possible) look for fuel in the filter housing or just press the fuel bulb, does it require pumping? Test for continuity of supply to the fuel supply valve to the rear of the pump. Check the small hand fit fuel return pipes attached to the injectors, they are a common fault for leaking. Has the exhaust been damaged at all or blocked....check. Hope this helps

Post by **Peter.N.** » 09 May 2005, 02:12

Also check your fuel filter, if blocked or contaminated with water it could be restricting the fuel flow

tone depear · Post by **tone depear** » 09 May 2005, 14:26

Huraah! Tis fixed. Was a dodgy electrical connection had worked loose on the stop solenoid (which I put on last week!). All go now! Thanks everyone.

tone depear · Post by **tone depear** » 10 May 2005, 04:20

Bottoms. [V]
I spoke too soon. It seems that when the engine is cold, the problem dissapears. Which makes me think it must be a fuel delivery issue, and something that must be by-passed by a cold start system of some sort. God, I wish I knew ANYTHING bout diesels. I feel so helpless!
I've tried getting it to happen whilst the car's at a standstill, and it seems that the fuel pressure seems to drop when it cuts out. What I've found is that by revving it til it cuts by hand, then the fuel pressure bulb thingy is soft and takes a few pumps to become firm. What I don't know if this is normal state when the engine isn't running. It starts again ok straight away. I might find myself limping by as it is til friday when I'm off work then just taking it to the garage.
Urgh. ££££££

jeremy · Post by **jeremy** » 10 May 2005, 04:44

When you refr to the dodgy electric conection do you mean you replaced the stop solenoid itself last week or just the connection/ If you replaced the solenoid itself it would seem there may be a link - if so why did you replace it and are all the bits underneath it there?
How old is this car? Do you have the Bosch or Roto Diesel pump? The reason is that each is affected differently by air. The Roto-Diesel uses fuel as a hydraulic medium for control purposes and if it gets air in it becomes unstable (can rev strangely and uncontrollably - but is not affected by leakoff pipe problems). The Bosch will not suffer from control problems when suffering from air but of course will not run on air but air can get in through the leakoff system.
I imagine your pump is purely mechanical (later pumps have some electronic parts but access to the start solenoid seems to be nearly impossible by design for security reasons) in which case they are generally reliable and the problems are generally confined to air in the fuel (loose pipes etc - don't leak fuel out but let air in), dirty filters or water in the fuel.) External linkages are worth examining as is the cold start mechanism, and on the Bosch the leakoff pipes are notorious for letting in air.(Roto-diesel simply leak and smell)
jeremy

fastandfurryous · Post by **fastandfurryous** » 10 May 2005, 04:54

This sounds very much like what happened to a friends 309 1.9D a good few years ago. It was a blocked fuel filter, which would only allow just enough fuel to flow for low power. When higher power was demanded, it strangled the engine and it cut out. After re-priming, it would start just fine.
Change the fuel filter as the most likely culpret, and see if it's still doing it.
David.

tone depear · Post by **tone depear** » 10 May 2005, 05:28

I replaced the stop solenoid because it was leaking fuel out the top. When I looked at it yesterday, the connection on top seemed loose - loose enough to perhaps not allow a good connection, at least. It's the roto-diesel pump. As far as I'm aware, all the bits underneath were fine, and I was careful to make sure everything went back right - once I'd put the new solenoid on, it ran 10 times better than it had before for a good week before this problem started. (Mainly due to all the fuel going to the engine, rather than oozing out the top of the solenoid and onto the floor!)
Is the fuel filter a reasonably easy job? Wehreabouts is it located?
(I'm at work, it's dark, and I can't easily go and look right now!)

fastandfurryous · Post by **fastandfurryous** » 10 May 2005, 14:24

Fuel filter is dead easy. It's inside that big black lump towards the right (as you look under the bonnet) of the engine, just above where the top radiator hose comes from. Locate the drain on the front of it, and drain a bit of fuel out. 4 bolts around the top, and the top comes off. Old filter out, O-ring onto the flange at the top of the new filter, filter in, cover back on. Prime the fuel system, and away you go. 10 minute job. If it's been in for anything more than about 20k miles, it's almost guaranteed to be bunged up with yuck.

tone depear · Post by **tone depear** » 13 May 2005, 01:03

£190 down. It's working again.
[}:)]
The old stop solenoid, it would seem, when it broke, had mostly disintegrated and all the bits had fallen into the pump. Pump, filter and everything else was full of bits. Pump cleaned, new filter, all seems well now. Feels like a new car, AND it even goes up hills!
[:I] I can't decide if I'm pleased or not!