Hi all
My Xantia has been parked for the last month, and just thought I would take it for a spin this morning.
Started OK, drove a little, wanted some heat, turned on the heat....woosh, big cloud of....steam i guess....indside the car!
Could this be the heater matrix, or is it just a hose that has come off?
The car isn`t wet on the floor.
Hope you can help. :-/
Xant. - Heater Matrix gone?
Moderator: RichardW
Doesn't sound good but by the same token, I still think you could be lucky enough for it to be a build up of condensation in the matrix area due to lack of use and prevailing weather conditions.
I would probably give you a 50/50 chance of this as you say there's no water under the carpet, so I'd suggest you drive it a bit more, don't get too far from home and keep a check on it as a Matrix change isn't the kind of job you do for practice.
Alan S
I would probably give you a 50/50 chance of this as you say there's no water under the carpet, so I'd suggest you drive it a bit more, don't get too far from home and keep a check on it as a Matrix change isn't the kind of job you do for practice.
Alan S
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fastandfurryous
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If you have only done basic servicing, then a Heater matrix change would be an immense amount of work. I recently had to do my 405's matrix, which is comparitively easy compared to a Xantia, and it still took me 2 days (well, 2 half-days), and a lot of skinned knuckles on bits of dashboard.
If you are having to pay someone else to do the heater matrix, especially with Danish prices, I'd be tempted to fill it up with stop-leak goop, and sell the car. As many people know, the method of manufacturing a modern car is to dangle the heater from a piece of string, and then build the car up around it! [:D]
If you are having to pay someone else to do the heater matrix, especially with Danish prices, I'd be tempted to fill it up with stop-leak goop, and sell the car. As many people know, the method of manufacturing a modern car is to dangle the heater from a piece of string, and then build the car up around it! [:D]
Hi FAF 
That doesn`t sound good.
First off. I was down investigating, and there is absolutely no wet areas. As soon as i move the leaver towards warm, it blows out a cloud of "steam", and it really stinks.
I don`t think it is condensation, because it wouldn`t smell that way.
I must say i could be tempted to say it was "just" a hose that has come off or leaking?
Secondly: I can`t really sell the car. I owe 30.000kr on it, and it is worth around 20.000-25.000kr.
A new used car is rather pricey. After what i can read, a car like mine will cost you guys around 500 pounds. That`s ~5000kr, so there is a big diff. I`m a student, so don`t have too much money.
How many hours would a skilled Citroen Mechanic take to change the matrix?
That doesn`t sound good.
First off. I was down investigating, and there is absolutely no wet areas. As soon as i move the leaver towards warm, it blows out a cloud of "steam", and it really stinks.
I don`t think it is condensation, because it wouldn`t smell that way.
I must say i could be tempted to say it was "just" a hose that has come off or leaking?
Secondly: I can`t really sell the car. I owe 30.000kr on it, and it is worth around 20.000-25.000kr.
A new used car is rather pricey. After what i can read, a car like mine will cost you guys around 500 pounds. That`s ~5000kr, so there is a big diff. I`m a student, so don`t have too much money.
How many hours would a skilled Citroen Mechanic take to change the matrix?
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fastandfurryous
- Posts: 1388
- Joined: 07 Jul 2004, 17:57
- Location: On the road, travelling at high speed. Meep Meep.
- My Cars:
- x 4
What does it smell like? Is it a sickly sweet smell, which after a while is rather nausiating? if so, sorry, that's coolant.
If it is only just beginning to leay, they often only leak once the cooling system has become hot and pressurised, and hence you get hot steam coming out of the heater. It's only once they've been leaking for a good while that they leak when cold, and then you get the wet carpet syndrome.
I don't know what the book time on changing a matrix is, but I would estimate it's got to be at least 8 hours. I know the book time on changing a 306 matrix is 10 hours, as I know someone who paid the £65 per hour, total £650 to have it changed. (daylight robbery!).
If the car is not needed on a daily basis, and can be taken off the road for an extended period, then I would say get a workshop manual, and have a go yourself. It's not particularly hard, just very time consuming, and fiddly. Label EVERYTHING that you're not sure of, and make sure you put all bolts/screws/fasteners back in the hole they came out of. A reel of masking tape to hold all the screws/bolts in place while it's apart is a wise investment.
If it starts to leak badly, and you need to drive the car, run with the pressure cap removed. If it gets really bad, then you can by-pass the heater, but it will be very cold in the car, and you'll have no demisting.
If it is only just beginning to leay, they often only leak once the cooling system has become hot and pressurised, and hence you get hot steam coming out of the heater. It's only once they've been leaking for a good while that they leak when cold, and then you get the wet carpet syndrome.
I don't know what the book time on changing a matrix is, but I would estimate it's got to be at least 8 hours. I know the book time on changing a 306 matrix is 10 hours, as I know someone who paid the £65 per hour, total £650 to have it changed. (daylight robbery!).
If the car is not needed on a daily basis, and can be taken off the road for an extended period, then I would say get a workshop manual, and have a go yourself. It's not particularly hard, just very time consuming, and fiddly. Label EVERYTHING that you're not sure of, and make sure you put all bolts/screws/fasteners back in the hole they came out of. A reel of masking tape to hold all the screws/bolts in place while it's apart is a wise investment.
If it starts to leak badly, and you need to drive the car, run with the pressure cap removed. If it gets really bad, then you can by-pass the heater, but it will be very cold in the car, and you'll have no demisting.
Yep, it is a really sweet smell, so i was guessing coolant too.
Problem is that something in my steering section is kinda broke. My buddys father has offered to fix it, but it has been parked for the last month. He isn`t into Citroen`s, so might as well do the matrix change myself.
This morning i would just take a little drive, to use the breakes and so on. Should have stayed in bed. :-/
I have Haynes BOL, so might as well have a go at it myself.
But do i need to get it fixed quickly, or else it will leak all the time?
Problem is that something in my steering section is kinda broke. My buddys father has offered to fix it, but it has been parked for the last month. He isn`t into Citroen`s, so might as well do the matrix change myself.
This morning i would just take a little drive, to use the breakes and so on. Should have stayed in bed. :-/
I have Haynes BOL, so might as well have a go at it myself.
But do i need to get it fixed quickly, or else it will leak all the time?
Michael,
I haven't had a decent look at the hoses leading to & from the matrix on a Xantia, but if they are as straightforward as a BX, we just got a fitting and connected them together as an emergency fix. I realise your temperatures and ours are at opposite ends of the spectrum, but as you're coming into your warmer weather, this may be an option to give you some time to organise it more conveniently than having to take it off the road immediately if it does in fact tun out to be a matrix.
That sweet smell doesn't sound hopeful though.
Alan S
I haven't had a decent look at the hoses leading to & from the matrix on a Xantia, but if they are as straightforward as a BX, we just got a fitting and connected them together as an emergency fix. I realise your temperatures and ours are at opposite ends of the spectrum, but as you're coming into your warmer weather, this may be an option to give you some time to organise it more conveniently than having to take it off the road immediately if it does in fact tun out to be a matrix.
That sweet smell doesn't sound hopeful though.
Alan S
I know I`m about to be slated for plugging this stuff again,but if I were you I`d try something like Barrs Stop Leak/Radweld before changing the matrix.
You have nothing to lose ,and who knows,it might just fix the matrix "permanently" and has done for me on more than one occasion.
Just trying to save you a lot of hassle as I`m all for the easy life - at the very least you get to procrastinate for a while!
Good luck anyway,
Regards
You have nothing to lose ,and who knows,it might just fix the matrix "permanently" and has done for me on more than one occasion.
Just trying to save you a lot of hassle as I`m all for the easy life - at the very least you get to procrastinate for a while!
Good luck anyway,
Regards
Alan,
It`s not on the road, and won`t be until the steering problem has been fixed. He will fix that for free, so i don`t really mind waiting.
I just figured i could run the system on cold, and not use the warm function. But could have a look, and see if i could just go around the matrix.
The weather is becoming better, but is rather rainy at the moment, and I have nowhere to stand, but the road.
To all:
Thanks for all your help, I really appreciate it.
I must say my Xantia is becomming rather annoying, and I have thought of selling it, and buy a Volvo or Saab. My folks have Volvo 740 Turbo from 1986, which i have borrowed for the last month.
And it really is a diff. build quality. Sure the ride in the Xantia is much better, but has a lot of problems. And with me not having much money, my primary target, is that it is cheap to keep running.
Oh well, time will tell....
It`s not on the road, and won`t be until the steering problem has been fixed. He will fix that for free, so i don`t really mind waiting.
I just figured i could run the system on cold, and not use the warm function. But could have a look, and see if i could just go around the matrix.
The weather is becoming better, but is rather rainy at the moment, and I have nowhere to stand, but the road.
To all:
Thanks for all your help, I really appreciate it.
I must say my Xantia is becomming rather annoying, and I have thought of selling it, and buy a Volvo or Saab. My folks have Volvo 740 Turbo from 1986, which i have borrowed for the last month.
And it really is a diff. build quality. Sure the ride in the Xantia is much better, but has a lot of problems. And with me not having much money, my primary target, is that it is cheap to keep running.
Oh well, time will tell....
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fastandfurryous
- Posts: 1388
- Joined: 07 Jul 2004, 17:57
- Location: On the road, travelling at high speed. Meep Meep.
- My Cars:
- x 4
if you don't fix it soon, it will get worse and worse. what you have to be aware of is that somewhere, the aluminium of the matrix, which used to be 0.5mm thick is now wafer thin, and leaking. The area around this leak will also be wafer thin, and fail in the near future. Either that, or if it's leaking from a seam, the repeated hot-cold cycling will open that crack up wide.
You could try a stop-leak or radweld type product, but personally I woun't let anything like that near my engine. It has been know for radweld to completely bung up some of the waterways in an engine, thus allowing it to boil. Fix the problem, not the symptoms.
Haynes BOL should be treated with caution. Personally I no longer trust any workshop manual unless it has come from the manufacturer. Even then there have been known to be mistakes.
You could try a stop-leak or radweld type product, but personally I woun't let anything like that near my engine. It has been know for radweld to completely bung up some of the waterways in an engine, thus allowing it to boil. Fix the problem, not the symptoms.
Haynes BOL should be treated with caution. Personally I no longer trust any workshop manual unless it has come from the manufacturer. Even then there have been known to be mistakes.
Michael,
I understand what FaF is saying,but I think the formula has changed over the years and clogging-up is a thing of the past.
I`d say you have nothing to lose(well maybe just a few kroner)and it may just save you a lot of hassle - it`s no fun removing a dash,especially at the side of the road.
As I said, I have fixed one or two like this and I went from sceptical to extremely pleased after seeing the results.
There are obviously for and against advocates of this stuff and I can see both sides of the argument,but,once again I think you have nothing to lose in trying it before resorting to removing the dash (which has been known to introduce it`s own problems,especially electrical gremlins)
I have the same model as you,only the estate version ,and I have to confess to using Stop Leak too when I had a suspected matrix leak only it wasn`t at the cloud of steam stage yet.If you wanted to bypass the matrix altogether as Alan suggested,the heater hoses are just behind and below the camshaft cover,on the RHD model anyway.
Once again good luck with whatever you try.
Regards
I understand what FaF is saying,but I think the formula has changed over the years and clogging-up is a thing of the past.
I`d say you have nothing to lose(well maybe just a few kroner)and it may just save you a lot of hassle - it`s no fun removing a dash,especially at the side of the road.
As I said, I have fixed one or two like this and I went from sceptical to extremely pleased after seeing the results.
There are obviously for and against advocates of this stuff and I can see both sides of the argument,but,once again I think you have nothing to lose in trying it before resorting to removing the dash (which has been known to introduce it`s own problems,especially electrical gremlins)
I have the same model as you,only the estate version ,and I have to confess to using Stop Leak too when I had a suspected matrix leak only it wasn`t at the cloud of steam stage yet.If you wanted to bypass the matrix altogether as Alan suggested,the heater hoses are just behind and below the camshaft cover,on the RHD model anyway.
Once again good luck with whatever you try.
Regards
Hi Folks
I have sort of decided to bypass the matrix. When the weather becomes warmer and dryer, i will have a look at the matrix. I don`t really need heat at the moment. I have a good bodyheat and reasonable layer of fat, for once that comes in handy.
I don`t want to poor anything than water and coolant into my cooling system.
As long as it can pass MOT with the matrix bypass, then it is OK.
Excellent forum, good and skilled people; A good combination.
I have sort of decided to bypass the matrix. When the weather becomes warmer and dryer, i will have a look at the matrix. I don`t really need heat at the moment. I have a good bodyheat and reasonable layer of fat, for once that comes in handy.
I don`t want to poor anything than water and coolant into my cooling system.
As long as it can pass MOT with the matrix bypass, then it is OK.
Excellent forum, good and skilled people; A good combination.