Automatic gearbox reliability thoughts

This is the Forum for all your Citroen Technical Questions, Problems or Advice.

Moderator: RichardW

Post Reply
egrid1
Posts: 14
Joined: 27 Sep 2003, 00:25
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Automatic gearbox reliability thoughts

Post by egrid1 »

Hi
Can anybody give me their thoughts on reliability of the auto gearbox fitted to a 2.1TD XM mid 90's car. I am not sure whether to go manual or Automatic route. I like the idea of auto but am worried abut reliability on a car that is bound to have around 150K on it. Apart from a test drive and listening for obvious noises are there any specific things one can do to test the gearbox?
Thanks
tomsheppard
Posts: 1801
Joined: 19 Dec 2002, 14:46
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Post by tomsheppard »

The XM auto has had a question mark over its reliability if I recall correctly.
I think that it has been known to blow its little microprocessed mind expensively.
Buy with extreme caution at 150k. Manuals are sound as far as I know and much as I like autos, I'd think a stickshift would give better peace of mind.
NiSk
Posts: 1422
Joined: 24 Jan 2002, 20:11
Location: Sweden
My Cars:
x 1

Post by NiSk »

Manual XM gearboxes comfortably exceed 500,000 km - given normal service. Auto's are an entirely different kettle of fish . . . Since Citroën never included any relevant servicing instructions for the auto box except changing oil, then its been up to the owner/educated garage to see that proper service was performed.
For example; the Saab 9000 of the same vintage had the same ZF auto box: Saab published a complete manual just for this box(!?) - it's available as a pdf - I've got a copy but nowhere to publish it and can't remember where I picked it up (!) Its about 6Mb.
IF the auto box was given the proper maintenance, then it should last well - but . . . who knows?
//NiSk
P 2501
Posts: 105
Joined: 18 Mar 2004, 12:59
Location:
My Cars:

Post by P 2501 »

A complete manual just for the auto gear box?!
Contents - change oil every 12 months.
er... what else?
NiSk
Posts: 1422
Joined: 24 Jan 2002, 20:11
Location: Sweden
My Cars:
x 1

Post by NiSk »

Contents: ATSG technical service information
Shift points at min throttle
Shift points at max throttle
Max kickdown shift points
Line pressure check
Brake band adjustment
Clutch and brake band application for all gears
Hydraulic operation description (6 pages)
Main valve body (shematic, 2 pages)
Upper valve body, shematic
Lower valve body, shematic
Main valve body orifice and ball location
Transfer plate orifice and ball location
Main valve body check ball location
Specific Saab 9000 Turbo operation (added shift overlap to compensate for additional torque)
Fault finding:
- No 3>4 or stacked 3>4
- harsh engagement into drive and harsh 4>3 downshift
- delayed or no reverse
- no forward, good reverse
- delayed forward engagement or premature failure of forward clutch
- transmision shudder when comimng to stop
Exploded view diagrams of gearbox (12 pages)
Hydraulic oil shematics (6 pages)
If you're really interested.
//NiSk
User avatar
davek-uk
Posts: 447
Joined: 29 Sep 2003, 21:01
Location: GL, UK
My Cars:

Post by davek-uk »

You live and learn. I never knew the Cit Autobox and the SAAB one were the same. My SAAB box was still going strong at 170k odd miles when its engine gave out. Regular oil changes and the kickdown switch was all it needed. I'd imagine it would be strong enough for the 2.1TD as the SAAB pushed out some power when booted. Does the Cit have the auto gear oil cooler pipe in the rad like the SAAB does? This is another consideration in view of the poor quality of Cit radiators - you don't want an auto box that has any coolant in it in the past.
DomF9
Posts: 80
Joined: 25 Mar 2004, 08:37
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:
Contact:

Post by DomF9 »

NiSk
I've got plenty of room on my site if you want somewhere to host it. Drop me an email if interested.
Regards
Dom
P 2501
Posts: 105
Joined: 18 Mar 2004, 12:59
Location:
My Cars:

Post by P 2501 »

I had no idea either that it was the same gearbox in the saab. If saab thought it was good enough for their cars then it can't be all that bad, can it?!
Paulxmski
Posts: 154
Joined: 13 Nov 2003, 04:20
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:
Contact:

Post by Paulxmski »

Hi,
Is the Auto box the same across all XMs'? Is the microprocessor that blows it's tiny mind a Bitron `A' unit and how does it control the gearbox in general terms?
Thanks.[:P]
egrid1
Posts: 14
Joined: 27 Sep 2003, 00:25
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Post by egrid1 »

Thanks for the thoughts so far.
Are there any specific chcks that you can make, in a test drive situation, that might give pointers to the condition of the gearbox, or potential trouble on the horizon?
tonespeed1999
Posts: 205
Joined: 10 Nov 2004, 23:30
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Post by tonespeed1999 »

the xm 2.1 sed with an auto box was a highly sought after car in its day!the car in general had a bad build quality.the only ones worth buying were the ones maintained properly.the auto boxes are reliable but only when maintained properly!
DLM
Posts: 524
Joined: 13 Aug 2001, 03:01
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Post by DLM »

So the Saab 9000 and the XM share more than a floorpan....
User avatar
Kowalski
Posts: 2557
Joined: 15 Oct 2003, 17:41
Location: North East, United Kingdom
My Cars: Ex 05 C5 2.0 HDI Exclusive 145k
Ex 97 Xantia 1.9TD SX 144k
Ex 94 Xantia Dimension 1.9TD 199k

Post by Kowalski »

The Alfa Romeo 164, Fiat Chroma, Lancia Thema and Saab 9000 all share the same floorpan, the XM does not.
Paulxmski
Posts: 154
Joined: 13 Nov 2003, 04:20
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:
Contact:

Post by Paulxmski »

Sorry to contradict you Kowalski but according to my book on the Citroen it does share the floorpan with the AF164 & Saab 9000 [;)]
jonathan_dyane
Posts: 229
Joined: 10 May 2004, 23:32
Location:
My Cars:

Post by jonathan_dyane »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Paulxmski</i>

Sorry to contradict you Kowalski but according to my book on the Citroen it does share the floorpan with the AF164 & Saab 9000 [;)]
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Very interesting. I would love to one day see one of these Citreons (sic) in the flesh...
Post Reply