I posted a message on here a week or 2 ago about a snapped heater control (hot/cold controller). I've now got the replacement.
The only way i can see of fitting it properly is to release the cables from the heater unit itself.
According to haynes i need to drain the coolant, remove the steering column plus god only knows what else, just to release the heater unit so i can get at the little nuts that hold the cables.
Access is very poor and i also need to get to the seized valve that caused the controller to brake in the first place. Anybody got any better ideas?
BX Heater controls
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tomsheppard
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Well, This is a bit of a tricky one and even worse to advise on. THe right way to do it is to remove the whole dashboard which is a bit of a job (two hours) and then you can at least SEE the valve which is to the left of the clutch pedal.
the gate valve can usually be gently forced after soaking them with your preferred loosenin' juice and experienced contortionists can do this without dismantling any thing more than the column shroud at a cost of a box of elastoplast. Fitting a new cable is much easier with the dash out, but if all else fails, AlanS has used the choke cable from a lawnmower which has an inbuilt lever. This he has located on the centre console and it works quite well. Th little nuts that hold the cables are a figment of the deranged Mr Haynes. Cables are retained by fiddly spring clips. Fit the lower end first. While you are at it, check whether the fan relay comes in. It is sited to the right of the steering column and you will hear it click if you turn the fan full up with the engine off. Or rather you probably won't. Many of these cars were constructed with a built in design fault wwwdottomshepdotcodotuk will show you what is required to fix it.Check that the carpets are dry, too.
Heater matrices fail for a pastime on older BXs which is how we all become so adept at removing dashboards in the first place. YOu do not have to remove the heater or drain anything down if you can get the valve to move. If time is tight, you could always move the valve to the hot position and wait until spring comes around.
the gate valve can usually be gently forced after soaking them with your preferred loosenin' juice and experienced contortionists can do this without dismantling any thing more than the column shroud at a cost of a box of elastoplast. Fitting a new cable is much easier with the dash out, but if all else fails, AlanS has used the choke cable from a lawnmower which has an inbuilt lever. This he has located on the centre console and it works quite well. Th little nuts that hold the cables are a figment of the deranged Mr Haynes. Cables are retained by fiddly spring clips. Fit the lower end first. While you are at it, check whether the fan relay comes in. It is sited to the right of the steering column and you will hear it click if you turn the fan full up with the engine off. Or rather you probably won't. Many of these cars were constructed with a built in design fault wwwdottomshepdotcodotuk will show you what is required to fix it.Check that the carpets are dry, too.
Heater matrices fail for a pastime on older BXs which is how we all become so adept at removing dashboards in the first place. YOu do not have to remove the heater or drain anything down if you can get the valve to move. If time is tight, you could always move the valve to the hot position and wait until spring comes around.
Your water valve probably seized because the 4 bolts/nits that secure it to the bulkhead pipes are TOO TIGHT.
When these are too tight, the heater temp. knob becomes very stiff to move and snaps if forced.
Loosen them off so the valve can be operated by the cable with ease.
I take it the part you are renewing is the white housing at the end of the cables?
I find the best way is to connect up the right hand cable first(nearest the steering wheel) and then work to the left with the other 2 cables.
When these are too tight, the heater temp. knob becomes very stiff to move and snaps if forced.
Loosen them off so the valve can be operated by the cable with ease.
I take it the part you are renewing is the white housing at the end of the cables?
I find the best way is to connect up the right hand cable first(nearest the steering wheel) and then work to the left with the other 2 cables.
Ian, you don't have to remove the dash.
Just pull off the 3 knobs, undo 2 screws, pull off the black housing c/w vents.
Remove 4 screws, 3 cables and 1 wiring plug.
Remove the printed circuit board and reassemble.
Don't forget to loosen the 4 bolts or else you'll break the new control.
No need to touch the coolant at all
Just pull off the 3 knobs, undo 2 screws, pull off the black housing c/w vents.
Remove 4 screws, 3 cables and 1 wiring plug.
Remove the printed circuit board and reassemble.
Don't forget to loosen the 4 bolts or else you'll break the new control.
No need to touch the coolant at all
Ian - I recommend you take a look at the black heater temp spindle on your new white panel. See if it's possible to swap in just this and its associated cogwork. You could save yourself a lot of trouble.
If you do choose to replace the complete white panel, then you will be involved in a triple version of "hunt the clip".
If you do choose to replace the complete white panel, then you will be involved in a triple version of "hunt the clip".
At the other (valve) end, under the dash, check and only disassemble as far as your need for access demands. A dependable and not-too-bulky light source helps. Getting the steering wheel off, and adopting a head-in-footwell posture are also a good idea. Removing the driver's seat or its lower seat squab may also aid access, but not comfort.
I'm slightly puzzled by Bernie's comments:
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Your water valve probably seized because the 4 bolts/nuts that secure it to the bulkhead pipes are TOO TIGHT.
When these are too tight, the heater temp. knob becomes very stiff to move and snaps if forced.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Bernie - is this comment born of recent experience? I've recently become well acquainted with these 4 bolts while swapping heater matrixes out/in. As they hold the flat-on-flat, ungasketed seal between matrix and bulkhead feed pipes it is tempting to tighten them up reasonably well. After all, the valve itself is on the bulkhead pipe side, isn't it, and the matrix with its feed pipes is just a slide-in fit?
If loosening the 4 bolts I'd certainly make sure there's a decent tray or bowl underneath in the footwell, especially if the heater valve position is uncertain. When removing a first (donor) matrix, I used the following "access" procedure: but bear in mind that I was after space for disengaging the matrix and then pulling it over to the rhs of the car for removal.
(1) removed the steering-wheel, shrouds and switchgear for access
(2) Disconnected the clamp between lower steering column spindle and upper steering column assembly (NB DO mark their "assembled" positions first)
(3) Unscrewed 4 x 10 or 12mm nuts securing upper column and then disengaged the column.
(4) Swore long and loud for the next couple of hours as I removed/disconnected more and more bits and pieces, including the plug-in earth assembly immediately in the path of matrix removal.
For the 2nd time (swap bad matrix out, swap good matrix in), I followed a complete dash-out procedure:
(1) removed the steering-wheel, shrouds and switchgear: removed glovebox + heater-vents, radio(?), clock tray, instrument panel and any remaining switchgear panels (e.g. foglight/mirror control panel ) I then removed dash in the following way:
(i)Inside car - Disengaged + removed dash end-bolts and spacers either end of dash at bottom.
(ii)Inside car: removed radio and gearbox console, or lifted out of way, then disconnected nuts/bolts holding central metal supports for dash either side of radio.
(iii) Outside car - opened bonnet to gain access to scuttle and removed remaining nuts/bolts holding dash (but not heater/ventilation block) in place. I may have removed wiper arm, and removed scuttle panel for better access - I don't remember.
(iv) Inside car: pulled out dash progressively and cautiously. As much of the loom is tie-wrapped to the dash at various points, these tie-wraps must be identified, noted, + snipped before removal.
(2) Found access a whole lot better. For matrix removal/replacement I again disconnected the steering column assembly, but this may be complete overkill for valve control work.
Apologies for the length of this one.....
I'm slightly puzzled by Bernie's comments:
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Your water valve probably seized because the 4 bolts/nuts that secure it to the bulkhead pipes are TOO TIGHT.
When these are too tight, the heater temp. knob becomes very stiff to move and snaps if forced.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Bernie - is this comment born of recent experience? I've recently become well acquainted with these 4 bolts while swapping heater matrixes out/in. As they hold the flat-on-flat, ungasketed seal between matrix and bulkhead feed pipes it is tempting to tighten them up reasonably well. After all, the valve itself is on the bulkhead pipe side, isn't it, and the matrix with its feed pipes is just a slide-in fit?
If loosening the 4 bolts I'd certainly make sure there's a decent tray or bowl underneath in the footwell, especially if the heater valve position is uncertain. When removing a first (donor) matrix, I used the following "access" procedure: but bear in mind that I was after space for disengaging the matrix and then pulling it over to the rhs of the car for removal.
(1) removed the steering-wheel, shrouds and switchgear for access
(2) Disconnected the clamp between lower steering column spindle and upper steering column assembly (NB DO mark their "assembled" positions first)
(3) Unscrewed 4 x 10 or 12mm nuts securing upper column and then disengaged the column.
(4) Swore long and loud for the next couple of hours as I removed/disconnected more and more bits and pieces, including the plug-in earth assembly immediately in the path of matrix removal.
For the 2nd time (swap bad matrix out, swap good matrix in), I followed a complete dash-out procedure:
(1) removed the steering-wheel, shrouds and switchgear: removed glovebox + heater-vents, radio(?), clock tray, instrument panel and any remaining switchgear panels (e.g. foglight/mirror control panel ) I then removed dash in the following way:
(i)Inside car - Disengaged + removed dash end-bolts and spacers either end of dash at bottom.
(ii)Inside car: removed radio and gearbox console, or lifted out of way, then disconnected nuts/bolts holding central metal supports for dash either side of radio.
(iii) Outside car - opened bonnet to gain access to scuttle and removed remaining nuts/bolts holding dash (but not heater/ventilation block) in place. I may have removed wiper arm, and removed scuttle panel for better access - I don't remember.
(iv) Inside car: pulled out dash progressively and cautiously. As much of the loom is tie-wrapped to the dash at various points, these tie-wraps must be identified, noted, + snipped before removal.
(2) Found access a whole lot better. For matrix removal/replacement I again disconnected the steering column assembly, but this may be complete overkill for valve control work.
Apologies for the length of this one.....
i've actually tried to do this job now by removing the heater trim panel and removing the broken control panel.
Trying to re-fit the control panel would be a piece of cake if access to cables was better. I cant get my hands in to re-clip those annoying little metal clips. The only way i can see of doing it is to release the cables at the heater unit or by gaining access some other way.
The haynes suggests you remove the heater unit which would allow the cables to be pulled through further to gain better access.
Even after i've done this though i'm still left with the issue of removing the stuck valve. Do i need to have the heater unit out to access the valve?
Trying to re-fit the control panel would be a piece of cake if access to cables was better. I cant get my hands in to re-clip those annoying little metal clips. The only way i can see of doing it is to release the cables at the heater unit or by gaining access some other way.
The haynes suggests you remove the heater unit which would allow the cables to be pulled through further to gain better access.
Even after i've done this though i'm still left with the issue of removing the stuck valve. Do i need to have the heater unit out to access the valve?
Hi David
Yes this is my experience on 2 BX's.
If the 4 bolts are over tightened, this distorts the valve making movement differcult!!!
By loosening slighty (not enough to cause a leak!!!) the valve becomes easy and free.
This is a possible cause of Ian's problem which is why I say fix it before you break another control panel.
Yes this is my experience on 2 BX's.
If the 4 bolts are over tightened, this distorts the valve making movement differcult!!!
By loosening slighty (not enough to cause a leak!!!) the valve becomes easy and free.
This is a possible cause of Ian's problem which is why I say fix it before you break another control panel.
Ian
First make sure the valve can be moved by just pulling and pushing on the inner cable.
Try my suggestion about the 4 bolts, it is possible to get a socket and spanner on them after removeing the steering column cover.
As to fitting the new control panel.
Leave the 3 cables connected at their lower ends.
Take a deep breath, have a good swear and start with the right hand knob/cable and finish with the left one.
When it's done swear you'll NEVER buy a bloody BX again
Job done.
Well done and go and lay down for the rest of the day
First make sure the valve can be moved by just pulling and pushing on the inner cable.
Try my suggestion about the 4 bolts, it is possible to get a socket and spanner on them after removeing the steering column cover.
As to fitting the new control panel.
Leave the 3 cables connected at their lower ends.
Take a deep breath, have a good swear and start with the right hand knob/cable and finish with the left one.
When it's done swear you'll NEVER buy a bloody BX again
Job done.
Well done and go and lay down for the rest of the day
Ian - is IS incredibly tight behind the panel and was definitely designed by a sadist. It CAN be done, but, as Bernie suggests, will involve much cursing along the way. D o you have any friends with long thin fingers? It may be worth enlisting them and being prepared to buy them several drinks for a favour.
To get the heater block out, if you really really wanted to do it, you'd need the complete dash off. You don't need the heater block out to get at the valve, which you should definitely check out before doing anything else. I'd concur with Bernie's statement about the access - possible with lower shroud off, and that the cables should stay where they are, at the other end, unless you can disconnect them one at a time and only reconnect once the white panel and has been secured.
To get the heater block out, if you really really wanted to do it, you'd need the complete dash off. You don't need the heater block out to get at the valve, which you should definitely check out before doing anything else. I'd concur with Bernie's statement about the access - possible with lower shroud off, and that the cables should stay where they are, at the other end, unless you can disconnect them one at a time and only reconnect once the white panel and has been secured.
UPDATE
As I never pass on info unless I've done it myself, I removed and refitted the heater control panel in around an hour just for you Ian.
I got the order wrong in my previos post.
This is what I did
Fit the 2 L/H inner cables
Fit the spring clip to the middle outer cable
Fit the spring clip to the L/H cable
Finally fit the R/H inner cable loop
and fit the final spring clip.
I only cut myself once[xx(][xx(][xx(]
As I never pass on info unless I've done it myself, I removed and refitted the heater control panel in around an hour just for you Ian.
I got the order wrong in my previos post.
This is what I did
Fit the 2 L/H inner cables
Fit the spring clip to the middle outer cable
Fit the spring clip to the L/H cable
Finally fit the R/H inner cable loop
and fit the final spring clip.
I only cut myself once[xx(][xx(][xx(]
I was beginning to think I may have just been big and awkward when I tried to do mine, but I'm beginning to feel better.
Now you all know why I did this!
http://www.aussiefrogs.com/snippets/heater.htm
We once had a 'Prime Minister' who famously said "life wasn't meant to be easy" but I really don't believe it was meant to be this bloody hard was it?[:D][;)][:(]
Alan S [}:)]
Now you all know why I did this!
http://www.aussiefrogs.com/snippets/heater.htm
We once had a 'Prime Minister' who famously said "life wasn't meant to be easy" but I really don't believe it was meant to be this bloody hard was it?[:D][;)][:(]
Alan S [}:)]
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Ian Fearn</i>
Thanks for all this advice, you lot are great!
Bernie, When you fitted these cables, was the white control panel screwed into place???
If so how did you access the spring clips???
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
No screws but keep the panel angled in behind the r/h screw holes.
Clips. place one in the slot over the inner cable and hold it with a l/h finger. Feed outer cable with r/h fingers then press clip home with left finger.
This is done whilst sitting on the hand brake lever[:0][:0]
When a clip then pings off towards the radio let out a loud $%&*"**[:(!]
Thanks for all this advice, you lot are great!
Bernie, When you fitted these cables, was the white control panel screwed into place???
If so how did you access the spring clips???
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
No screws but keep the panel angled in behind the r/h screw holes.
Clips. place one in the slot over the inner cable and hold it with a l/h finger. Feed outer cable with r/h fingers then press clip home with left finger.
This is done whilst sitting on the hand brake lever[:0][:0]
When a clip then pings off towards the radio let out a loud $%&*"**[:(!]