Spheres, Hydraflush and Brake Bleeding

Guides on how to approach the more common problems experienced by our members.
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demag
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Post by demag » 01 Jul 2009, 18:15

Ah! Sorry Jim. Guess that means I'm an idiot then. :cry:
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Post by CitroJim » 01 Jul 2009, 19:20

demag wrote:Guess that means I'm an idiot then. :cry:


Never in a million years, ever :wink: :D
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Anti-sink

Post by rpaco » 03 Jul 2009, 18:59

Drove to Lincoln in the end to GSF for seals. Worked out a lot cheaper than postage (£4.50min GSF) with waste veg oil at 50p/lit from The Green Team in Attleborough.

Maybe worth mentioning that after you spend half an hour with your new 9mm flare spanner (Halfords) moving the flare nut as much as 1/32nd of a turn each time, you deserve a treat, so when putting the new sphere and seal on once you have the pipe located in the hole and the sphere just started if you hold the nut in the flare spanner as you screw the sphere on it saves another half hour. I might be tempted to try this next time taking one off but would need to be very sure and keep checking that pipe is not binding on the sphere.

However I am completely stuck on the front accumulator sphere. I just cannot undo the old one. I have a homemade chain wrench which with leverage of about 1 metre will not budge it. I have also tried a hammer and cold chisel and even my SDSplus Electric Hammer with a chisel bit whilst leverage also applied. Penetrating oil 3 applications.
Have tried from bottom and top, can I stick a blowlamp on it?

Was wondering what to do with the old spheres then realised why the French invented boule!
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Re: Anti-sink

Post by CitroJim » 04 Jul 2009, 17:39

rpaco wrote:However I am completely stuck on the front accumulator sphere. I just cannot undo the old one.


The trick with a Pleiades tool or similar is to apply pressure to the end of the handle whilst simultaneously hitting the end of the handle with a club hammer. If it still refuses to move, put an extension pipe on the end of the tool and give that a bash whilst applying pressure. Sometimes the front hydractive centre sphere needs the same treatment.

Also, check the pressure regulator block is firmly secured to the gearbox and not flexing as you apply pressure.
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demag
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Post by demag » 04 Jul 2009, 22:46

I bought one of those cheap tools off ebay and after using it a few times the handle bent trying to get the rear centre sphere off my Xm. I took it to work and found some really beefy tube. I cut a length about 450mm long and welded it over the old handle. It's a lot more efficient now and I haven't failed to undo a sphere yet. I always dose them with releasing oil for a few days first though. :D
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Re: Anti-sink

Post by rpaco » 05 Jul 2009, 14:23

CitroJim wrote:
rpaco wrote:However I am completely stuck on the front accumulator sphere. I just cannot undo the old one.


The trick with a Pleiades tool or similar is to apply pressure to the end of the handle whilst simultaneously hitting the end of the handle with a club hammer. If it still refuses to move, put an extension pipe on the end of the tool and give that a bash whilst applying pressure. Sometimes the front hydractive centre sphere needs the same treatment.

Also, check the pressure regulator block is firmly secured to the gearbox and not flexing as you apply pressure.


Which direction are you hitting it in?
My home made chain wrench gives the handle at a tangent to the sphere in this case on the top (after removing the intercooler rubber pipes.) starting vertically then pressing the lever/handle towards the back of car as force is applied. I have added leverage up to the open bonnet (minus a bit to allow some movement if the thing cracks) then blocked that leverage/force "on" with wooden blocks between the lever/handle and the top of the radiator, then whilst it is under tension , hit the sphere with hammer and cold chisel. There is some flev in the lever as the jack handle bends a few mm between the two sections of thick wall piping. The only way to make it stiffer is I think to re-make it with some 1" dia steel barrel gas pipe. (the sort the plumber used to cut a thread onto on site, wall thickness of about 6mm) and try again. I have pushed as hard as I can, but I am rather nervous about breaking the regulator or what it is screwed to.
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Post by CitroJim » 05 Jul 2009, 16:12

My, that's tight :shock: The correct direction to undo the sphere is anti-clockwuise as you look end-on at the sphere. If you are in any doubt (and I always am when faced with a silly, tight one) is to hold a nut and bolt in front of the sphere and work out which way is undoing it..

From your description, yours should have given up the fight by now as you have essetially been doing right.

Anoter trick is to place a large jubilee clip around the spnere, do it up really tightly and bash on that.

If all else fails, you may have to try to remove the sphere block with the sphere still attached. If you do, you'll see why you're right to be worried about thumping it too hard. All that holds it is two 11mm (M7) studs...

At least if you remove it complete, you can secure the lot in a sturdy vice...

In the end, well applied percussion will be the secret.
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Post by myglaren » 05 Jul 2009, 18:00

CitroJim wrote:In the end, well applied percussion will be the secret.


Percussive maintenence. It's the American Way! :D
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Post by Clogzz » 06 Jul 2009, 13:38

added leverage up to the open bonnet

The bonnet opens past vertical; not against the windscreen, but about 10 degrees past vertical.
It will need securing there somehow, otherwise a wind gust or movement can slam it shut.
Picture from Simon Mandrake’s site:

http://homepages.igrin.co.nz/simon/imag ... -crack.jpg
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Post by citronut » 05 Oct 2009, 08:14

Jim wrote
"The correct direction to undo the sphere is anti-clockwuise as you look end-on at the sphere. If you are in any doubt (and I always am when faced with a silly, tight one) is to hold a nut and bolt in front of the sphere and work out which way is undoing it.. "

this is what my sister in law says when remebering which wayto turn a right hand thread
"leftey loosy righty tighty"


regards malcolm
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Post by AbangCorp » 17 Nov 2009, 16:59

According to plieade advice, the correct sphere is more than enough to get the original magic carpet ride back


bought myself a new rear suspension sphere
it is grey! is it?

REAR SUSPENSION CYLINDER SPHERE X 2 PCS
SPHERE + GASKET 400CM3 30 BARS 52 – 5271 23

Original - i believe so, have green sphere fitted. I think it's original.
my new one grey in colour, part number 5272.34. This grey sphere is sealed in original citroen grey box - suppose to be original?

The capacity 400cm3 all right, and 30 bars

Can anyone confirm this? Thanks in advance


Haha, having 30 printed on the sphere, it should indicate the pressure

is there anything that i need to take care of. If i didnt do hydraflush, thus that mean the solid inside will reduce sphere life span. how to make it longer in this respect?


i also heard c5 sphere, it is triple more expensive than normal xantia sphere, last forever. is the adaptor (c5 to xantia) available?

if available, does that mean changing c5 sphere will make into xantia will make my xantia last forever as well?

thanks
abang irfan[/img]
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Post by AbangCorp » 17 Nov 2009, 17:27

hmm, i notice that most of you guys emphasize on using the ramp if you want to change the rear sphere

i only have a pair of axle stand, is it enough
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Post by xantia_v6 » 17 Nov 2009, 17:36

When loosening the rear spheres it is necessary to have full pressure in the rear suspension, which is perhaps easier on ramps, but I did this with the rear wheels sitting on a couple of solid concrete blocks, with axle stands placed as a safety backup.

If using stands as the primary support, be aware of the sideways force you may be applying while loosening the spheres
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Post by AbangCorp » 18 Nov 2009, 15:11

According to plieade advice, the correct sphere is more than enough to get the original magic carpet ride back


bought myself a new rear suspension sphere
it is grey! is it?

REAR SUSPENSION CYLINDER SPHERE X 2 PCS
SPHERE + GASKET 400CM3 30 BARS 52 – 5271 23

Original - i believe so, have green sphere fitted. I think it's original.
my new one grey in colour, part number 5272.34. This grey sphere is sealed in original citroen grey box - suppose to be original?

The capacity 400cm3 all right, and 30 bars

Can anyone confirm this? Thanks in advance


Haha, having 30 printed on the sphere, it should indicate the pressure

is there anything that i need to take care of. If i didnt do hydraflush, thus that mean the solid inside will reduce sphere life span. how to make it longer in this respect?


i also heard c5 sphere, it is triple more expensive than normal xantia sphere, last forever. is the adaptor (c5 to xantia) available?

if available, does that mean changing c5 sphere will make into xantia will make my xantia last forever as well?

thanks
abang irfan
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Post by Old-Guy » 18 Nov 2009, 16:44

You need to tell us the exact Xantia model before anyone can confirm any data.

There's a table of spheres on my web site.
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