micro engines

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citronut
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micro engines

Post by citronut »

a freind sent me an email today with several working minature engines, but not sure how to add them here but googled working minature engines, and found this one

http://www.streetfire.net/video/scaled- ... _76187.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



This should please anyone who appreciates miniturisation.

SOME PEOPLE THINK THEY ARE MACHINISTS ...
AND SOME REALLY ARE!
V-8 and V-12 Engines in Miniature!


For all you out there who like big, honking V-8's and screaming V-12 engines, check out these tiny versions that you could run on your workbench or kitchen table. These models were built by craftsmen the same way the big ones are made by machining billet stock and castings,
But in miniature.

These are not just models that look like engines, they are real running engines. Some of these photos were taken from the Joe Martin Foundation Craftsmanship Museum but many more images can be found elsewhere on the web, and engines like these can be seen in person at model engineering shows around the country.
Here are some really nice examples:

All images located at the foot of the post.

The late Lee Root built this ¼ scale Corvette engine The major components were machined entirely from solid billet aluminum that has been bead blasted to look like castings, and it will turn 18,000 RPM! The coin you see in some of the photos for size reference is a US Quarter.
The valve covers are just 4-1/2" long, and the miniature spark plugs are commercially available.


This 1/3 scale billet machined, supercharged Chrysler 300 Hemi racing engine from the 1960s was built by James Weber. It has a 1.0" bore and 0.90" stroke displacing 5.65 cubic inches. The engine burns gasoline or methanol (methyl alcohol) on dual electronic spark ignition and incorporates a two-stage pressurized dry-sump lubrication system. It will turn around 12 grand and uses a couple of computer cooling fans on the radiator to keep things cool. Note the professional looking throttle and gauges on the stand.


Here's a V-8 and a half ; a ¼ scale Ferrari V-12 by Jeron Classic Motors. It has double overhead camshafts, burns methanol on glow ignition and is equipped with two oil pumps for dry sump lubrication. All six carburetors function and are linked together for smooth operation. The heads and block are about 7-1/4" long. Only a few of these were made before the company went out of business, so it's pretty rare. Like many of the engines you see here, it is on loan to the Craftsmanship Museum courtesy of Paul and Paula Knapp and their Miniature Engineering Museum




Here's another twelve. The late Al Ingersol built this Curtiss D-12D 1/6 scale V-12 airplane engine completely from billet stock and also built a model Curtiss Wright P 6E biplane to put it in. The engine is only 9" long and weighs 6 pounds. It has a 0.80" bore and 1.062" stroke, displacing 6.46 cubic inches.


One of the more popular model V-8 engines over the years has been the Challenger.
This one was built by Ron Colonna. Casting kits are still available for this 1/3 scale
Engine through Coles Power Models, although it is definitely not a beginner project.


Several V-8 engines by Ken Hurst are displayed at a model engineering shows like the
Recent Western Engine Model Exhibition (WEME) in Vallejo , CA . How about that
Supercharger! Behind the first engine is his blue Challenger V-8. The 103 cc engine
Sounds great running on a mixture of white gas and high octane racing fuel.


Eugene Corl built this 1/3 scale Chevy V-8 using engine castings he produced himself.
The engine is seen here at the Gas Engine Antique Reproduction Show (GEARS)
In Portland, Oregon.

cid:11.4130227351@web81303.mail.mud.yahoo.com
Seen above are some of the wooden patterns, molds, cores and raw castings that had to be made to build Gene's 1/3 scale Chevy V-8. Once cast, the parts must be precisely machined just like real engine components. When you look at one of these finished little engines, keep in mind all the planning, preparation, fixturing and behind-the-scenes work that goes into making one.



The three photos above show the world's smallest known running Chevrolet V-8. Jim Moyer built this 1/6 scale version of a 1964 365 HP Chevrolet Corvette 327. Note the tiny firing order cast into the intake manifold just like on the real thing. The heads and block are machined from billet aluminum. Jim even made stamping dies to make the oil pan, rockers and front cover. The valve covers are investment cast.


The finished 1/6 scale 5-bearing crankshaft fits in Jim's hand. It utilizes real Babbitt bearings.


Here you can see the cylinder heads of the Moyer 327 plus the stamped oil pan and front cover. Some parts inside the engines are made to scale like the 30-30 Duntov camshaft, but some things have to be modified to make a small engine run. Electricity and fuel molecules don't scale, so some parts have to be slightly heavier or larger than exact scale would dictate. Getting a small engine to run requires skill and careful work; getting one to run well is an art.

Here's a shot of Jim's tiny Corvette V-8 being test run.
He is now working on a 1/6 scale Chevy 409.

Gary Conley came up with the ¼ scale Conley V-8 in the 1980's. This version has twin carbs. You could buy it as a kit or as a completed engine. Gary is now building what he calls the "Stinger 609" V-8 that will soon be available as a complete running engine. A supercharged Stinger 609 running in a 1/4 scale dragster. Impressive!


Paul Knapp built this great looking version of the Conley V-8. It runs twin carbs on
a fully functional Roots style 671 blower and will turn 12,000 RPM on methanol.
Note the nicely painted and highly polished finishes on this beautiful engine.
(Did you notice that the ignition switch even has its own set of keys like a real engine?)


A Cirrus V-8 by Profi M.E. of the Ukraine is based on the Merritt Zimmerman design.
The exposed rocker arms need to be manually lubricated before running the engine.
Again, note the really nice finishes on every part.


This is one of only six air-cooled Micro Cirrus 1/12 scale V-8s produced by Profi M.E.
using the components from a run of 4-cylinder Micro Cirrus engines. Six water-cooled
versions were also built. The cylinder heads on this rare V-8 are only about 2" long.
Note the size of the quarter at the bottom of the photo. This thing is TINY!


This 87 cc V-12 by Martin Ohrendorf of Germany has a 21 mm bore and stroke, 24 exposed rocker arms and three carbs. It will spin a 24/10 propeller at 4500 RPM. One just like it can be seen running on YouTube.


This scale 426 Hemi V-8 by Roger Butzen was made by using parts of a plastic model kit for reference. This one, however, is all metal and it RUNS! Only the air cleaner decal from the plastic kit made it to the final running version.


Here is another Challenger V-8 at the WEME show in Vallejo . This one was built by
Dick Pretel and sports triple carbs. Starter, batteries and other peripherals are hidden in
the wooden base. It even has carrying handles! Big fins on the valve covers help with cooling.

The Joe Martin Foundation for Exceptional Craftsmanship has a machine shop in their
museum in Vista , CA , where they are currently building a miniature Howell V-4 engine.
They have documented the build step-by-step so you can see what it takes to put together a running miniature engine.

Send this on to every 'Motorhead' you know.

The craftsmen who build these little beauties deserve plenty of recognition.


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regards malcolm


Unfortunately, due to the way the images were received, it was not possible to accurately locate them within the document therefore they are grouped together here.
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Re: micro engines

Post by myglaren »

Pictures and descriptions added.
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Re: micro engines

Post by citronut »

thanks hunny
much ass grassy ass

regards malcolm
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Re: micro engines

Post by DickieG »

Fantastic engineering but to me its wasted just sitting on a bench, they need to be put in a RC car or truck.

Those stationary engine you see at some car shows where a single cylinder diesel engine pumps water from one bucket to another stood next to it leave me thinking, what's the point?
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Re: micro engines

Post by robert_e_smart »

Those stationary engine you see at some car shows where a single cylinder diesel engine pumps water from one bucket to another stood next to it leave me thinking, what's the point?
Each to their own. I often think the same when I see 2CVs. Whats the point?
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Re: micro engines

Post by citronut »

eeeer steady on there Robert
nout wrong with a dersh (2CV )

regards malcolm
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Re: micro engines

Post by CitroJim »

I can fully appreciate the engineering skill that's gone into these models but that's it. I've always been one for the real thing at 1:1 scale, excepting my fleet of Citroen models that grace the coffee table of course!!!
DickieG wrote:Fantastic engineering but to me its wasted just sitting on a bench, they need to be put in a RC car or truck.

Those stationary engine you see at some car shows where a single cylinder diesel engine pumps water from one bucket to another stood next to it leave me thinking, what's the point?
Quite agreed. It's a very sad sight in my eyes to see a once proud Lister or the like chuffing away doing very little. The ones I've seen have not been running well because they are not being given a decent amount of work to do. Those old engines need to be given proper work to do...

It comes from when I was a kid and lived in a rural community and used to watch dad sawing up logs for winter on a big saw-bench having a three foot circular saw driven by a big old Ruston & Hornsby stationary engine. It idled a bit roughly but once it got it's teeth into a big tree it ran beautifully... I remember the procedure to start it - fill the water jacket up with water (no rad, just a big open water jacket which used to steam like a steam engine), fill the carb with petrol, check the main full tank was full of TVO (Tractor Vapourising Oil - like paraffin or kerosene), disengage the drive to the saw-bench and swing it over on the starting handle. Chuff-chuff-chuff and away it would go... Once warm and the initial fill of petrol had been used up it would then run for the rest of the time on TVO. The smell of an engine burning TVO even now is a very evocative one for me...

Much later in life I used to have dealings with 15KVA diesel generating sets powered by Lister HR2 twin cylinder engines. Although normally they were on electric start, they could be hand started and that had to be tested regularly. The hand starting involved setting the decompressors and then engaging a mighty ratcheting staring handle on a spigot projecting from the crank. Then, with the decompressors set, the engine was swung over until the crank was rotating at a good speed and then you'd reach up and flick off the decompressors whilst readying yourself for the kick as the engine came onto compression and fired. The big secret was to never let go of the starting handle when the engine fired up. To do so was to invite a rapidly spinning handle to slowly work itself off the spigot and then fly at some velocity across the engine house hoping it would land somewhere fairly innocuous. If someone did accidentally loose grip on the starting handle it was a case of dive for cover immediately :lol:

I used to love hand starting them...

To see such a generating set running just a lightbulb for public entertainment would be a very sad sight for me...
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Re: micro engines

Post by Dippy »

Would you prefer they were scrapped - and forever lost to the world ?

Hailwoods six cylinder 250 Honda 's mournful wail does ( did ) it for me , for others it's the " buckida - buckida " of a lister etc.

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Re: micro engines

Post by Dippy »

A link - hopefully ? to an old exhaust valve from one of my engines


http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/4257/p1040114s.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: micro engines

Post by CitroJim »

Dippy wrote:Would you prefer they were scrapped - and forever lost to the world ?
No, absolutely not but please give them some sensible work to do. Have the small Lister running an elevator and building a haystack say, or have a larger engine running a sawbench cutting up logs. Or a genset running a contemporary fairground ride perhaps..

Back along, one Christmas, I was thrilled to see (and ride) a vintage carousel (merry-go-round) being powered by a steam showman's engine :-D Perfect and that engine was doing precisely what it was built to do. It had a big DC generator mounted atop it's boiler being driven by a flat canvas belt.

All I'm saying is watching a big Lister running a little Stuart-Tuner pump moving a gallon of water from one bucket to another is not very representative or interesting. History should be kept in context.
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Re: micro engines

Post by Dippy »

CitroJim wrote:
Dippy wrote:Would you prefer they were scrapped - and forever lost to the world ?
No, absolutely not but please give them some sensible work to do. Have the small Lister running an elevator and building a haystack say, or have a larger engine running a sawbench cutting up logs. Or a genset running a contemporary fairground ride perhaps..

Back along, one Christmas, I was thrilled to see (and ride) a vintage carousel (merry-go-round) being powered by a steam showman's engine :-D Perfect and that engine was doing precisely what it was built to do. It had a big DC generator mounted atop it's boiler being driven by a flat canvas belt.

All I'm saying is watching a big Lister running a little Stuart-Tuner pump moving a gallon of water from one bucket to another is not very representative or interesting. History should be kept in context.

Hi Jim , please define " sensible "

Sensible - as in let decent minded people enjoy themselves , including old French cars and Model Aeroplanes ?

Or - Sensible - as in Old Cars are dangerous and pollute , Model aircraft are dangerous and noisy :shock:

Cue - Health and safety - Local Gov' jobsworths , charges and taxes , insurances , safety checks , risk assesments , et al ' and the general feeling in the UK that anytime someone starts to enjoy themselves ? some Kn..b...d is going to stop them doing so !

Horses for courses , some people prefer stamp collecting , is that representative and interesting enough :wink:
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Re: micro engines

Post by Xaccers »

Sensible as in:
CitroJim wrote:Have the small Lister running an elevator and building a haystack say, or have a larger engine running a sawbench cutting up logs. Or a genset running a contemporary fairground ride perhaps..
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Re: micro engines

Post by Dippy »

God forbid I am ever labelled as " sensible "

There are only 3 types of persons that scrape my nadgers :

Those who take themselves too seriously

Those who take life too seriously

Both of the above .
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Re: micro engines

Post by CitroJim »

Dippy wrote:God forbid I am ever labelled as " sensible "

There are only 3 types of persons that scrape my nadgers :

Those who take themselves too seriously

Those who take life too seriously

Both of the above .
Same here :) Agreed fully on all points.. I'd just like to add one more: Health and Safety zealots...

I was perhaps wrong, in retrospect, in using the word 'sensible' in my original post.

All I'm trying to say is that if you are going to exhibit a nicely restored vintage engine then make an effort to exhibit it doing the kind of work it would have been doing when it was earning its living. Otherwise it's no more than a freak show, an idle curiosity with no value at all.

As for health and safety, what's wrong with building a hayrick or sawing up trees to demonstrate these engines working? Last time I saw a display of these engines, looking pathetically sad I might add, they were behind and impenetrable barrier of 'Heras' fencing anyway which added to their sadness. They looked like prisoners...
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Re: micro engines

Post by citronut »

CitroJim wrote:Back along, one Christmas, I was thrilled to see (and ride) a vintage carousel (merry-go-round) being powered by a steam showman's engine :-D Perfect and that engine was doing precisely what it was built to do. It had a big DC generator mounted atop it's boiler being driven by a flat canvas belt.

talking of working steam powerd fairground rides is this still going

http://www.hollycombe.co.uk/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

regards malcolm
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