Would you like fries with that car?

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 16 Jun 2007, 23:40

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/briefs/excise-duty/brief4307.htm

From June 30th, no more tax on SVO if you use less than 2500L a year!

Woohoo!

Now I have a dilema, keep the 2.1TD or keep the 1.9TD...

bxbodger · Post by **bxbodger** » 17 Jun 2007, 01:04

Don't get too excited: this only seems to refer to biofuel, and they don't class SVO as a biofuel: as far as I know it's something to do with the esters, which is why SVO has always attracted the full rate of fuel duty as opposed to the reduced rate which was paid on biofuels.

Note the wording: it says 'produce', rather than 'use'....which implies proper home brewed biofuel, not SVO

A probable mis-quote from Zulu: 'The bast@rds: they're mocking us'.......

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 17 Jun 2007, 06:53

That's what I thought so I re-read it about 10 times.
It definitely says biofuel which is what SVO is, not biodiesel.

Previously they didn't consider SVO as biodiesel because of it's esters etc so classed it as diesel substitute (despite diesel actually being SVO substitute!) but this definitely says biofuel.

Though I do fully expect SVO to be excluded anyway simply because they're evil.

James.UK · Post by **James.UK** » 17 Jun 2007, 15:08

I emailed the customs and excise people months ago, asking if the proposed changes would permit me to run my car on cooking oil. The reply was YES! no problem, I posted their reply on this forum at the time, but can't remember the dates now

It's good news for us non ECU peeps huh ...

I intend to start running on a 50/50 mix in the very near future.

I already carry a 2litre bottle of c/oil in the boot in case I ever run out of fuel.
.

weety · Post by **weety** » 19 Jun 2007, 00:43

its definate you can run on SVO, WVO or Bio and its no tax (till you pass 2500 litres)

makro is a good place to pick up SVO with 20 litres going for £9.50 to £10.50 ...... yep thats 50p odd a litre..........

so trade in your C5 for a nice xantia or ZX td and roll back your fuel prices

i wonder if its going to push the prices up of old cars that require minimal to no mods to run on veggy?

one of the best being of course (drum roll) the humble XUD9 coupled to a Bosch pump

Sl4yer · Post by **Sl4yer** » 21 Jun 2007, 14:39

That's all interesting info. It must be time for a good read-up on all the past veggie oil threads!

But I think I'm correct in saying that my 1995 Volcane (with the Bosch pump) can run a standard vegetable oil unmodified and at 100%. And that the fuel filter will require changing once or twice shortly afterwards.

Can anybody confirm (or otherwise debunk) my thoughts?

Thanks,

James

KP · Post by KP » 21 Jun 2007, 15:05

Yey i cant wait to sell the coupe now and get back on the badnwagon and maybe convert my dads 2.1td to a mechanical pump as well if they are found to be as good as the 1.9td bosch pumps for taking SVO

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 21 Jun 2007, 15:13

KP wrote:Yey i cant wait to sell the coupe now and get back on the badnwagon and maybe convert my dads 2.1td to a mechanical pump as well if they are found to be as good as the 1.9td bosch pumps for taking SVO

What IP will you use? One from an old 2.1 XM?

James.UK · Post by **James.UK** » 21 Jun 2007, 16:30

Hi Sl4yer..

Yes your car should run perfectly well on cooking oil straight from the bottle. Dependant on where you live, it may be a good idea to thin it down a bit in winter by mixing more diesel with it..

Why would you need to change the filter?? Ok as a maintainace item it's fine, but the two are not related.. I did nothing to my car whatsoever when I tried cooking oil, I just poured it in.

The car ran/performed better on it, but I lost about 10% re mpg.
.

weety · Post by **weety** » 21 Jun 2007, 17:23

sometimes the veggy can lift all the gunk out of the tank, fuel lines etc that all ends up in the filter

i run a xantia with a bosch pump on SVO (but i have added a fuel heater for it)

Post by **CitroJim** » 21 Jun 2007, 21:17

Xac wrote: What IP will you use? One from an old 2.1 XM?

Interesting! I've just been poring over pr.net...

The old 2.1 XM used either a Roto-Diesel (Lucas) or a Bosch pump according to pr.net. You'll need to find a 2.1 XM with the XUD11ATE engine with the Bosch pump without the keypad immobiliser made before RP6088 (about 1994?) and get the pump, injectors and pipes from it. This will be the non-ECU controlled pump and the easiest to get working. The later XUD11ATE also could have a Bosch Pump but this has an ECU and keypad immobiliser. This could be more difficult. You'd need the keypad and ECU and also need to know the code for it.

The only difficulty will be arranging a throttle cable for it. I guess you'll need a throttle pedal and cable from an early 1.9TD.

Wonder what the chances are of finding that little lot in a scrappy?

I'm wondering just what the difference is between the early 2.1 Bosch pump and injectors and the Bosch Pump and injectors fitted to early Xantia 1.9TDs. What I getting at is will the 1.9TD pump and injectors work on a 2.1 or is the fuelling and timing requirements too different for this to be satisfactory. I'm mindful you have spare non-ECU 1.9TD pump Andy

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 22 Jun 2007, 08:42

I know, if that pump could be used, it would be great!
Grr we need a bosch expert

Is the pump from an early XM 2.1TD listed on pr.net?
Don't suppose it has the same number as an early 1.9TD pump?

Would we need to confuse the ECU as it won't have a pump to drive?

KP · Post by KP » 22 Jun 2007, 17:47

Im looking at another route which would mean ripping the pump apart and remaking it so it can take SVO/WVO just like the bosche but i dont think it would be cheap mind....

Post by **CitroJim** » 22 Jun 2007, 18:26

KP wrote:Im looking at another route which would mean ripping the pump apart and remaking it so it can take SVO/WVO just like the bosche but i dont think it would be cheap mind....

Not as bad as it sounds, I'm led to believe it is the fibre vanes of the lift pump (those lift pumps again

) that don't take kindly to the higher viscosity SVO and break up.

I've certainly read somewhere of someone replacing these with steel but I have no ideas of how successful it was.

Post by **CitroJim** » 22 Jun 2007, 18:42

Xac wrote:I know, if that pump could be used, it would be great!
Grr we need a bosch expert

Is the pump from an early XM 2.1TD listed on pr.net?
Don't suppose it has the same number as an early 1.9TD pump?

Would we need to confuse the ECU as it won't have a pump to drive?

I looked. Unfortunately the two pumps have different (although not very) part numbers

The ECU would not be required at all. It could be removed entirely. All you would need to do is rig an ignition-switched supply for the stop solenoid and ensure the glowplug controller still works as expected.

You'd loose control of the EGR valve but we won't shed any

over that though. Also, you'd loose the coded keypad. The needle lift sensor and the TDC sensor would become redundant.

In fact thinking about it, if you got a dead keypad it would be easy to build a simple electronic combination lock unsing it to control the stop solenoid