Are they trying to kill off DIY?

This is the place for posts that don't fit into any other category.

Moderator: RichardW

oilyspanner
Posts: 1246
Joined: 26 Oct 2003, 17:08

Post by oilyspanner » 28 Nov 2004, 16:31

There are other conventions too, I was commissioning a coal washery in Belgium a number of years ago when a Belgian Electrician did a triple somersault away from a junction box (about sixty feet above ground level)he had pulled the fuse but was working the wrong (live)side of it! We will all be in the hands of Kwik Fitters before long, people are changing too, I recently saw a car containing four young blokes patiently watching an AA man change their flat tyre! What a shower of helpless Bas***ds I thought.
Stewart

ACTIVE8
Posts: 2316
Joined: 16 Nov 2004, 17:49
x 1

Post by ACTIVE8 » 28 Nov 2004, 18:41

They are probably going to be politicians when they get older[:)][:D][:D][:D]

martyhopkirk

Post by martyhopkirk » 28 Nov 2004, 21:11

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Jon</i>

Red is Live and Black is neutral, right? Not in the EU folks. From 1st January:
<b>LIVE is BLACK
NEUTRAL is BLUE!</b>
So, some person will pop down to Wickes, buy a roll of twin & earth (if the EU let us keep the earth) and confidently wire the black in the cable to the black in their existing circuit. Bang!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Perhaps stocking up now on propper MK brand T & E with the <i>propper</i>(red/black) colour is in order?

Jon

Post by Jon » 28 Nov 2004, 21:42

Too right, I'm off down to Wickes tomorrow for a roll of 1.5 lighting cable and a roll of 2.5 T&E before its too late.
Luckily I have already changed my consumer unit and rewired the ring mains, just the upstairs lights to do as upstairs and downstairs lights are on the same trip right now, which isn't desirable. They're certainly not going to get done in the pesky continental colours!

bxbodger
Posts: 1455
Joined: 23 May 2003, 03:34
x 1

Post by bxbodger » 28 Nov 2004, 21:49

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">the UK will be harmonised with Europe<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
And don't even think about the situation now with fire extinguisher colours-is it the red one, or the other red one, or that red one......aaaarrrghhhh!!!!!
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">the nearest bus stop is about 10 klms away and the bus runs twice a week <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Better service than we get over here in the old country then........

JohnD
Donor 2016
Posts: 2507
Joined: 15 Mar 2001, 00:41
x 28

Post by JohnD » 29 Nov 2004, 00:20

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Jon</i>

Too right, I'm off down to Wickes tomorrow
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Maybe you'd better get in a stock of UK square pin sockets - that'll likely be the next EU order we'll have to conform with.

tomsheppard
Posts: 1801
Joined: 19 Dec 2002, 15:46

Post by tomsheppard » 29 Nov 2004, 00:35

Ridiculous isn't it. Our thirteen Amp system (Which is of course German, MK meaning Multi Kontakt) is the safest I've ever seen. Danish electrics are the reason that there are only 5 million Danes and the French system is little better. Once again, Europe is calling the shots because GB is running away from Europe and not Running it.
Newsflash! RHD cars to be banned on Thursday.
Newsflash, Dateline Friday. The Govenment's new initiative for the Roads has led to a 90 percent reduction in vehicle pollution and a dramatic reduction in road casualties as a result of which, 80% of ambulance drivers will be laid off.
Police forces have announced a massive decrease in serious crime, having caught a second burglar.
Car scrapping tax wil be raised to £5000 from Monday.

landylass
Posts: 16
Joined: 26 Oct 2004, 17:48

Post by landylass » 29 Nov 2004, 01:06

[:)] Could it also be that is a pre cursor to each house having its own "passport"? Where every DIY jobbie has to be recorded and have a competance cert with it, an extention to the house sellers pack, I think this is the law currently in scandanavian countries. And I do remember some reference to it coming up in the media here a couple of years ago , wasnt it beenig trialed somwhere in the uk?
Big Bro is definatley watching ......scary. And even more stealth taxes. [:(][:(!][:(!]

Homer
Posts: 1458
Joined: 26 Feb 2003, 11:52
x 5

Post by Homer » 29 Nov 2004, 01:39

<s>Anyone got any links I can look at for this, it sounds too mad to be true (which probably means it is).
Plus, my dad who is in the building trade (plumber though) hasn't mentioned it, if I remember I'll ask him.</s>
OK, it's not quite as bad as it's being made out but it seems like a load of regulation for no apparent benefit. Typical Tony and his cronies stuff.
Couple of links...
http://www.screwfix.com/talk/thread.jsp ... 1&tstart=0
http://www.iee.org/Publish/WireRegs/PartP.cfm
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Q11: How will Part P apply to DIY work?
Part P will apply to all electrical work in dwellings, whether carried out by professionals or DIYers.
Some DIY work will require the submission of a building notice to the local authority and the payment of a building control fee.
Some minor electrical work will not be notifiable, as explained above. Examples include adding a lighting or power point to an existing circuit, adding a spur to an existing circuit or replacing a light fitting.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
You'll still be able to change/add sockets and light fittings providing they are not in a kitchen/bathroom/garden/swimming pool (so the back of the Xantia estate is out then[:o)])

Homer
Posts: 1458
Joined: 26 Feb 2003, 11:52
x 5

Post by Homer » 29 Nov 2004, 02:27

Sorry, had to add this because it made me chuckle.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Q16: Won't Part P simply drive more work 'underground'?
The Regulatory Impact Assessment considered the question of whether regulation would result in more unsafe work. The Government do not consider there is any evidence that this will be the case.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
In other words, if we close our eyes it doesn't exist.[xx(]

AWG
Posts: 82
Joined: 19 Oct 2003, 14:51

Post by AWG » 29 Nov 2004, 15:30

If the work is not done by a registered electrician then the Local Authority will inspect it (at a charge of some hundreds of pounds) and certify it.
A seller of a house will be required to declare work done and provide the certificate given by the installer (certified) or LA.
I cannot but imagine that the willingness of householders to have work done cheaper (no VAT declared?) by cowboys will increase as the cost of certification increases prices.
The new colours in wiring could bear investigation. There appears to be a rather nasty conflict when it comes to 3 phase.
Perhaps we need a few premature deaths to flush the gene pool - but should it be incompetent DIYers or politicians. Lines are open now for your vote!

bxbodger
Posts: 1455
Joined: 23 May 2003, 03:34
x 1

Post by bxbodger » 29 Nov 2004, 16:23

There are many good things about the EU, but unfortunately we have a government that doesn't know how to play the same lip-service game the way the rest of them do. Eastern European countries clamoured to join: why?-because of the better standard of living.
Our government tries to enforce all the silly stuff mentioned in these postings, with religous fervour, yet it ignores the directives on cross channel shopping, and secured an exemption on limited working hours!!!We work the longest hours in Europe, and still can't bring stuff in from Calais without the illegal seizure of our cars.....grrrrrr

I was in Luxembourg this summer, and thats a place where they have taken full advantage of membership, not fought against it.We have a fridge mountain because our government couldn't get organised in time for the disposal legislation, and who do the tabloids blame -the EU!!
I for one would much rather be part of a United States of Europe, than be an extra add on state to the United States of America, as Tony Bliar seems to want!!!!
End of rant........................

Jon

Post by Jon » 30 Nov 2004, 22:20

Correction to the wiring colours:
For domestic installations live will be Brown and neutral will be blue, as these are the colours used in domestic cable to appliances, this should be fairly easy to work with. Having said that, if the wiring in your house does get inspected, and the new blue/brown T&E shows up, then the house will be deemed to have wiring work done after 1/1/2005 and the new rules (and costs apply).
Its only in industrial installations using 3 phase that live will now be Black.

nick
Posts: 1079
Joined: 14 Mar 2001, 02:49

Post by nick » 01 Dec 2004, 00:29

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Jon</i>

if the wiring in your house does get inspected, and the new blue/brown T&E shows up, then the house will be deemed to have wiring work done after 1/1/2005 and the new rules (and costs apply).
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
That was originally the idea, the new regs were supposed to be introduced at the same time as the new colours, but it hasn't quite worked out like that. Introduction of the new regs was delayed, and some electrical wholesalers have been supplying the new coloured cable for a month or two already, which means that cable with the new colours can't be proved to have been installed after 1/1/05.

DervDonkey
Posts: 65
Joined: 25 Oct 2004, 01:08

Post by DervDonkey » 01 Dec 2004, 03:56

I suppose that if you want to be bloodyminded about it and chuck a monkey wrench into the Guv'ment paper machine, you could always buy the appropriately specced red, black and green/yellow wire separately and use conduit pipe - this method is maybe a bit more expensive, but who could tell when the work was done?