Another "speared" Xantia strut top...Check YOURS!

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andmcit
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Post by andmcit » 02 Jun 2008, 23:45

The key difference is the main feed diameter for the hydraulics but there
is an additional difference between the estate and V6 models - as far as
s2's go I've no idea but the listing Anders posted a few pages back looks
like it covers all the variants if you're thorough in deciphering the Citroen
gobbledegook.

The W reg one's WILL be s2 so just cross reference the parts listing.
I'd imagine you'll be OK if you're changing a matching pair and the car
is a saloon though I guess it's a case of the proof of the pudding being in
the eating etc - it would be worth just taking note of the diameter of the
inner piston on the strut on your car, and that of the donor car if it's
practical to do so.

Andrew
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Post by red_dwarfers » 03 Jun 2008, 13:18

Cheers

Went down to the scrappy today, they had 6 or 7 complete struts for £35 each, armed with a screwdriver I found that all of them had pealy rust, I was gutted!
Off to the Citroen Stealership I go, 200 squid worse off!
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Post by red_dwarfers » 05 Jun 2008, 11:03

I picked up some new ones from Citroen yesterday and they were just like the ones in the guide with the indent bit on the front.
Just a tip for those that will buy new, I was a bit cheeky and asked the parts guy if he could give me a better price, an instant knockdown from £105 each to £92.

I've now got an 'extra' £26 to spend on something else!
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Post by myglaren » 05 Jun 2008, 11:26

red_dwarfers wrote:I picked up some new ones from Citroen yesterday and they were just like the ones in the guide with the indent bit on the front.
Just a tip for those that will buy new, I was a bit cheeky and asked the parts guy if he could give me a better price, an instant knockdown from £105 each to £92.

I've now got an 'extra' £26 to spend on something else!


Nice one R_D. I am generally to wussy to try that. It's never worked when I have either.
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Post by red_dwarfers » 05 Jun 2008, 15:17

I suppose this is directed to Andrew, but if anyone gets there first!

I've got as far as this with the NS:
Image

I got the nut off with a monkey wrench but im having a bit of a hard time with "THIS" trying to get it off with an Allen key, could you explain this in an even more layman's terms?

I'm also having a bit of trouble getting the pipe that goes into the back of the strut mounting, i've unscrewed the screwy bit, but im a little wary that I will break something if I yank it too hard on the pipe as it seems stuck in fair, and i don't want to break anything :wink:

Thanks in advanced!
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Post by DickieG » 05 Jun 2008, 17:52

red_dwarfers wrote:I got the nut off with a monkey wrench but im having a bit of a hard time with "THIS" trying to get it off with an Allen key, could you explain this in an even more layman's terms?
Thats the top of the strut, its a wedge fit which needs a tap from a hammer (use a wooden block to break the seal).

red_dwarfers wrote:I'm also having a bit of trouble getting the pipe that goes into the back of the strut mounting, i've unscrewed the screwy bit, but im a little wary that I will break something if I yank it too hard on the pipe as it seems stuck in fair, and i don't want to break anything
Again you'll need to use force to break the seal, in this case a twisting action.
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Post by andmcit » 05 Jun 2008, 18:22

Yep, you need to knock the threaded end down. Just be very careful
when knocking the threaded end down off the taper on the strut top
as you can spoil the thread and that'll mean replacing the whole leg!

Then watch the driveshaft seal when swinging out the strut top - for
more space remove the wheel if this is the first strut top change...

Just take your time!!

Andrew
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Post by red_dwarfers » 05 Jun 2008, 21:49

Cheers.
The inner strut is now compressed down into its home, I went to put a fair amount of pressure on the hub assembly to swing it down and out and after I put the new mounting on I saw that the inevitable happened....drip drip drip of oil - driveshaft slipped out a couple of inches didn't it :oops: :cry:

And guess what? To top it my trusty old jack failed me not long afterwards, luckly the car was blocked up. (whats the third thing going to be?!)

Is it just a case of slipping the driveshaft back into the gearbox and wiggling it a bit?

I'll take a photo tomorrow of the current situation for others amusement of what not to do. I'm going to have a go with taking of the drop link arm of the anti roll bar and see if I can force the strut back up into the mounting.


Sorry about the long post!
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Post by andmcit » 05 Jun 2008, 22:07

Don't worry about long posts here; that's the point of this forum;
the more you describe, the easier it is to get a clear picture for
others to offer advice.

The driveshaft is a simple spline press fit that should seal as soon
as it's pressed firmly home - it's normal length is governed by
the hub being firmly located!

You SHOULDN'T need to undo the drop link; leave that can of
worms for another time...

Andrew
Last edited by andmcit on 05 Jun 2008, 22:46, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by CitroJim » 05 Jun 2008, 22:23

As Andrew says, don't ever worry about long posts, the longer and more descriptive the better.

Last time I checked, the forum database server had 160Gb of free space so plenty of space for those long posts!
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Post by lexi » 05 Jun 2008, 22:36

andmcit wrote:
lexi wrote:Brilliant job!.. Might I be humble enough to say don`t use
high mod silicone near steel ............it produces acetic acid on curing.
Better with polyurethane (Sikaflex Tigerseal etc). These sealants also take
paint better.


Damn! Sounds like my plan here wasn't such a good idea at the end of that
day after all - I've used acrylic based sealant in the past where it was easier
to paint over. I'm no scientist so will be led by you; is this something I
need to worry about and dismantle to rectify or just something to be aware
of the next time around on the opposite strut?

How much potential damage am I adding to this already volatile
location/duff design defect!?

Andrew


If surface was well painted then maybe no harm at all. To give an idea of what High Mod can do. If you stick a mirror to a wall the HM silicone can eat through the glass and peel the surface of the mirror. Acrylic is ok but they are water based although stable and harmless when dried.

Sika 221 is high mod polyeurathane. It has no acetic acid and is suitable on even bare metal. It cures so stiff that it can be used as an adhesive as well as a sealant........also takes paint.
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Post by andmcit » 05 Jun 2008, 23:27

red_dwarfers wrote:...after I put the new mounting on...


Out of interest, what state is the removed strut top in? Any scary pics or
is it a case of 'better safe than sorry, it could've held on a bit longer...'

Realistically, you could be OK just topping the lost oil and getting on with
things, but if you've left it 'open' with the driveshaft not sealed home for
any length of time, you'll have lost a lot of the gear oil and it'd make sense
to change the opposite side strut top next - there's a chance the same
leakage from the driveshaft may happen again.

Make certain that you've been sold the correct type of gearbox oil. I've
found a small vent on the top of the gearbox acts as a handy filler neck
with a set of small 99p cookery funnels aiding filling up.

Andrew
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Post by red_dwarfers » 07 Jun 2008, 21:02

Okay im going to take a proper advantage of using these looong post limits!

Couldn't get any pictures taken as I've "temporarily mislaid" the camera :lol:

Anyway got the NS back only to find that when hitting the inner strut down I had a dosey moment and left the nut on only to find when putting everything back together the thread was crossed :oops: Got around that by cutting a few mm's off the top of the thread and crudely sorting out the couple of spirals of thread still a the new top by making good use of a junior hacksaw; Suffice to say everything went back on perfectly with locite threadlock and the top of the inner strut is level with the top of the nut.
If I couldn't get the thread sorted out with enough to at least level off with the nut I would have gone down the strut from scrapedealer route and replaced the darn'd thing.

Just one last thing to do tommorow - oil's. Got the gearbox oil to redo after it all poured out, and got to check the LHM level.

The OS was a lot easier and I had learnt a LOT from the NS so to get it in took less than half an hour.

My top laymans tips for the less mechanically minded or those learning like myself:

Don't hit the top of the strut with the nut still on. :oops:
Use a bit of metal in between the top of the inner strut and the hammer to prevent any burring.

You may find it useful to play with turning the steering to left/right/centre lock to make it easier initally knocking out the taper in the strut top mounting and when putting the strut back up into the new mounting.

If swapping the pair of them make you don't mix up the NS and OS as they point in slightly different directions.

When you have compressed the inner strut into the outer strut ready to swap the strut top mounting you may find that you can't get the strut down far enough to get it out the ring of the strut mounting. An easy way to move it out the way is to use a longish bar on top of the antiroll bar and underneath the subframe/chassis and carefully prise it down a bit to move the strut accross towards the gap on the passenger compartment side. Its useful to have a second person to hold this down (they won't need to put much pressure on) while you switch your mountings.

When putting the inner strut up into the mounting I got someone to use a trolley jack and a bit of wood to jack up the hub into the mounting while I directed the strut into the mounting (This is where the steering tip can come in handy). Once I got the outer strut up as far as I could I used the force of twisting the allen key to pull up the inner strut far enough to put the nut on.

Use threadlock.

Take your time, don't rush.

I found it easier to take the tyre off.

For the sake of 15 quid, for god's sake use axle stands!

Thats all that I can think of at the present, I hope it will help at least one person in the future!
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Post by citronut » 07 Jun 2008, 23:04

andmcit wrote:
red_dwarfers wrote:...after I put the new mounting on...


Out of interest, what state is the removed strut top in? Any scary pics or
is it a case of 'better safe than sorry, it could've held on a bit longer...'

Realistically, you could be OK just topping the lost oil and getting on with
things, but if you've left it 'open' with the driveshaft not sealed home for
any length of time, you'll have lost a lot of the gear oil and it'd make sense
to change the opposite side strut top next - there's a chance the same
leakage from the driveshaft may happen again.

Make certain that you've been sold the correct type of gearbox oil. I've
found a small vent on the top of the gearbox acts as a handy filler neck
with a set of small 99p cookery funnels aiding filling up.

Andrew


Andrew its only the N/S shaft which can pull out of the diff when doing this job in this way, as the O/S shaft is held in place by the intermediate bearing,

and have you only just found the vent also being a filler plug to, and it is even easyer if you unscrew thre hole gearbox vent (17mm socket)
regards malcolm
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Post by andmcit » 07 Jun 2008, 23:19

You're quite right there Malcolm - had a bit of a 'total plant-pot' moment
there!!

I've undone the plastic/nylon 'bolt' on the top of the gearboxes on Xm's and
Xantia for years now, though was led to believe there was a lower metal
plug that you're 'supposed' to fill into - never looked, never worried!!

Am I just getting blurred edges in my thinking with gearbox oil filling up
for Gs boxes!!! :roll:

Andrew
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