Confessions of a Citroholic

Tell us your ongoing tales and experiences with your French car here. Post pictures of your car here as well.

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myglaren
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by myglaren » 04 Dec 2017, 18:29

RichardW wrote:
04 Dec 2017, 08:46
Is that nut loose on the pipe, Steve? In which case it needs the correct fitting to seal against the flare on the pipe - can't think what it would be called.... maybe ask the maker of the cooker, but then they'll probably just reply that they can't tell you anything if you are not Gas Safe.

Yes, it is and buts up to a sort of flare, but a flattened one.
Have emailed B.E.S where I have an account though unused for years - still get at least one email from them each week, also the manufacturer.
No response from either yet.
I work with an ex BG installer and he also is completely baffled at that fitting.

Agree about the restriction of info but my reply would be that we would want to have the parts on hand for when the BG engineer comes to fit them and commission the cooker.
Don't want to risk them turning up and not have suitable fittings with them, as it appears to be so unusual.

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bobins
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by bobins » 04 Dec 2017, 20:09

myglaren wrote:
04 Dec 2017, 18:29

Have emailed B.E.S where I have an account though unused for years - still get at least one email from them each week,


I usually get a 'Friday Only Deals' email from them each week...... it normally turns up on Saturday or Sunday. :roll:

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by myglaren » 04 Dec 2017, 20:49

bobins wrote:
04 Dec 2017, 20:09
myglaren wrote:
04 Dec 2017, 18:29

Have emailed B.E.S where I have an account though unused for years - still get at least one email from them each week,


I usually get a 'Friday Only Deals' email from them each week...... it normally turns up on Saturday or Sunday. :roll:


One just arrived :)

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by RichardW » 05 Dec 2017, 09:18

myglaren wrote:
04 Dec 2017, 18:29


Agree about the restriction of info but my reply would be that we would want to have the parts on hand for when the BG engineer comes to fit them and commission the cooker.
Don't want to risk them turning up and not have suitable fittings with them, as it appears to be so unusual.


This might be the thing?. See their response to the question about the thread size :lol:

Alternatively something out of BES's flare range.

What is the standard fitting on the cooker hose?

Gibbo2286
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Gibbo2286 » 05 Dec 2017, 11:00

What's the make of your boiler? Vaillant have a lot of stuff online in PDF form, parts lists and repair manuals etc. if yours is a different make maybe you can find similar stuff for them.

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by myglaren » 05 Dec 2017, 19:32

RichardW wrote:
05 Dec 2017, 09:18
myglaren wrote:
04 Dec 2017, 18:29


Agree about the restriction of info but my reply would be that we would want to have the parts on hand for when the BG engineer comes to fit them and commission the cooker.
Don't want to risk them turning up and not have suitable fittings with them, as it appears to be so unusual.


This might be the thing?. See their response to the question about the thread size :lol:

Alternatively something out of BES's flare range.

What is the standard fitting on the cooker hose?


Thanks Richard - the first one looks as though it may be suitable but the BES flares have nothing at all that looks as though it would.
Typical that I get loads of emails from E-spares as I have used them a lot in the past but never twigged they would have gas fittings, only bought electrical stuff from them.
No response from BES or Belling :(

Gibbo - my boiler is a Chaffoteaux et Maury but the house is currently owned by Gentoo housing association although I am in the process of buying it.

There are indeed manuals available online for them though.

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Gibbo2286 » 06 Dec 2017, 12:05

Plumb Center list a lot of parts for that make.

https://www.plumbcenter.co.uk/webapp/wc ... rchView

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by myglaren » 06 Dec 2017, 22:55

Note through the door when I got home this evening - they had been to repair the boiler :roll:

I was actually going to call at PlumbCentre tomorrow evening but see my local one has closed.
The one in Team Valley (10 miles away and passed it twice this evening) is manned by the most rude and unhelpful crowd you could imagine :(

Did eventually get a reply from the manufacturers but not much help - have been able to send them photo's now though so that may be a turning point.

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by myglaren » 07 Dec 2017, 20:36

Progress with the cooker, the manufacturer has given me a part number for the missing connector - will get it ordered tomorrow.

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Mandrake
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Mandrake » 11 Dec 2017, 22:23

RichardW wrote:
29 Nov 2017, 13:35
Most gas fitters will not have read the regs, and will not have understood, or misheard what they were told, or they were not told correctly!

Link to the regs: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1998 ... tents/made

And the relevant section on competency:

Para 1 says competent, para 3, which refers to approved persons, only relates to employees / self employed persons.
Just to come back to this again - I think your whole position hinges on the interpretation of the word "competent"... I suspect that the use of the word we are familiar with (somebody who knows what they are doing) and the legal definition of it in legislation will be very different. I suspect "competent" means "qualified" in the eyes of the regulators. Looking elsewhere I see a more complete version of the regulations you quote:

http://www.hse.gov.uk/pUbns/priced/l56.pdf
Regulation 3(1)–(2)

(1) No person shall carry out any work in relation to a gas fitting or gas
storage vessel unless he is competent to do so.
(2) The employer of any person carrying out such work for that employer,
every other employer and self-employed person who has control to any extent of
such work and every employer and self-employed person who has required such
work to be carried out at any place of work under his control shall ensure that
paragraph (1) above is complied with in relation to such work.
The same as what you posted, then immediately under it:
ACOP 3(1)–(2)

80 Gas work should only be undertaken:
(a) by a person who has successfully completed an industry-recognised
training course followed by assessment of competence. Training that
leads to assessment of competence in safe gas work should be
recognised by the industry’s standards setting body; or
(b) in the case of a currently or previously registered person, where they
have proved competence through a certification scheme; or
(c) for those working at premises that fall outside the scope of the
Regulations (see regulation 2(4) and associated guidance), by a person
who has successfully completed an appropriate full training course
followed by assessment of competence.
81 Training should be of a standard to enable a gas engineer to achieve
competence in the safe installation, purging, commissioning, testing,
servicing, maintenance, repair, disconnection, modification and dismantling of
the gas systems, fittings and appliances with which they are working. This
should include an adequate knowledge of:
(a) relevant associated services such as water and electricity; and
(b) the potential for exposure to asbestos; and
(c) the dangers these may give rise to; and
(d) the precautions to take.
But then immediately below that:
Guidance 3(1)–(2)

82 Anyone who does work on a gas fitting or gas storage vessel must be
competent to do so (whether or not they are required to be a member of an
approved class of persons). Therefore, do-it-yourself gas engineers and those
performing favours for friends and relatives all need to have the required
competence. The level and range of competence should match the full extent of
work done, but needs only to be sufficient for and relevant to that work.
83 Employers of gas engineers are also required under regulation 3(2) to ensure
that their employees have the required competence for the work undertaken; in
addition to ensuring they are properly experienced and trained (see paragraph 86).
This involves ongoing monitoring of performance standards, as necessary.
84 Competence is a combination of practical skill, training, knowledge and
experience to carry out the job in hand safely, and ensuring the installation is left in
a safe condition for use. Knowledge must be kept up-to-date with changes in the
law, technology and safe working practice.
So after reading all that somewhat contradictory text I'm still unclear on the legality of non commercial DIY gas repairs on your own equipment by someone like myself who is not gas safe registered... Any thoughts ?
Last edited by Mandrake on 11 Dec 2017, 22:34, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by myglaren » 11 Dec 2017, 22:28

Adapter hasn't arrived yet but I called at a well-known hardware outlet this evening for a hose, in readiness.
I was asked if a Gas Safe person would be fitting it and I assured them that they would be.

Then the salesperson said- "I just fitted mine myself" :)

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bobins
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by bobins » 11 Dec 2017, 22:59

Mandrake wrote:
11 Dec 2017, 22:23
84 Competence is a combination of practical skill, training, knowledge and
experience to carry out the job in hand safely, and ensuring the installation is left in
a safe condition for use. Knowledge must be kept up-to-date with changes in the
law, technology and safe working practice.
So after reading all that somewhat contradictory text I'm still unclear on the legality of non commercial DIY gas repairs on your own equipment by someone like myself who is not gas safe registered... Any thoughts ?



It's interesting that part 84 doesn't mention anything about being qualified.
I think, in the end, working out whether you're competent would be as Homer Simpson declares: "That's for the courts to decide"

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by xantia_v6 » 12 Dec 2017, 00:29

In France, gas cooking appliances are always connected via flexible hoses, and the hoses are available in larger supermarkets. The hoses come in 3 categories: 5 year, 10 year and 'lifetime', with an appropriate price differential.

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Mandrake
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Mandrake » 12 Dec 2017, 11:43

xantia_v6 wrote:
12 Dec 2017, 00:29
In France, gas cooking appliances are always connected via flexible hoses, and the hoses are available in larger supermarkets. The hoses come in 3 categories: 5 year, 10 year and 'lifetime', with an appropriate price differential.

Our gas cook top is connected using a flexible hose - I would have thought they all would be, otherwise how do you pull the cooker out to clean behind it ? A completely solid connection with no movement just seems to be asking for a gas leak if the cooker ever rocks around or anyone attempts to pull it out...

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Gibbo2286 » 12 Dec 2017, 13:18

Flexible hoses are a modern thing, cookers used to all be solid pipe fitted.............and rarely cleaned behind.