Confessions of a Citroholic

Tell us your ongoing tales and experiences with your French car here. Post pictures of your car here as well.

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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by RichardW » 26 Nov 2017, 22:16

Internals of the dishwasher; solenoid half way up that tank at the front by the big door spring. Now fixed :)
IMAG4910[1].jpg
Tackled the boot switch on the Picasso. Of course ours is the 'different' switch, but it's easy to change over. However, on removing the trim strip, 2 of the clips were broken. Not sure what has happened there, been reversed into, or something into it. No obvious damage to the outside however. A few more strips of ali plate, and some 'Stix all' glue (it really does!), and all is good again:
IMAG4913[1].jpg
Here's the boiler band aid (rubbish pic...). You can see the jubilee clip and the gunge. It is pretty well watertight, just a hint of a leak, to which I have added a bit more sealant. Will the boiler run? Will it heck. Reports a fan fault. Got power up to it, but no dice FFS :twisted: New one ordered for £70, last throw of the dice. I'm really rather fed up of it now :roll:
IMAG4916[1].jpg
Not too bad in here, we've got a log burner that is working hard, and a tank with an immersion, so we've got hot water. In theory I could run the heating with the immersion on and we'd get 3kW which would air the rads, not got that bad yet....!
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Zelandeth » 26 Nov 2017, 22:35

What on earth is that huge plastic tank in the dishwasher for?

Have only had one apart before and it definitely was laid out rather differently. It had a small cylindrical "sump" below the wash cavity which held the pump and heating gubbins.
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by myglaren » 26 Nov 2017, 22:57

Zelandeth wrote:
26 Nov 2017, 22:35
What on earth is that huge plastic tank in the dishwasher for?

Have only had one apart before and it definitely was laid out rather differently. It had a small cylindrical "sump" below the wash cavity which held the pump and heating gubbins.

My eldest daughter had one of those tanks in hers.
It packed up and I went to investigate.
Tried all sorts and was stumped, nothing worked.
Saw a part of the tank was full of rice and tomato sauce.
Removed tank but couldn't get access to the tomato rice bit.
Took it home and that bit is welded on. Turned out to be the ion exchanger :oops:

Flushed it out - it is something of an fluid dynamic maze and I don't pretend to know what it does nor why or how it does it but when refitted it worked perfectly.

Fixed by accident :roll:
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by RichardW » 27 Nov 2017, 14:01

As myglaren, no idea what the tank is for; it's got lots of internal pipeways and things, and at least 3 outlets off the bottom. There is some fouling inside, as Steve notes!
Mandrake wrote:which I'm not allowed to change myself since it would disturb gas lines
Actually, nothing to stop you doing that - the gas regs only require any one doing gas work to be 'competent' - it's only when you get into charging for the work that you need to be certified. Changing the fan on ours involves disconnecting the gas supply to the burner.... Am I competent :!:
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Gibbo2286 » 27 Nov 2017, 14:12

I did my own last year, I think as someone who's been successfully repairing cars every day of my working life for the last sixty plus years I should be considered competent enough to make a simple gas tight joint.
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by CitroJim » 27 Nov 2017, 14:57

Gibbo2286 wrote:
27 Nov 2017, 14:12
I did my own last year, I think as someone who's been successfully repairing cars every day of my working life for the last sixty plus years I should be considered competent enough to make a simple gas tight joint.


Exactly...

I do all my own and I and my house are still 100% intact so I guess I must be competent too :)
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Zelandeth » 28 Nov 2017, 18:36

I used to work on the basis of "I won't touch anything gas."

Then I found that a so called certified engineer working for a major company had fouled several things up, leaving not one but two joints leaking. Since then I've decided the bit of paper is worth precisely nothing and that I'll be checking over anything an "engineer" does in future anyway. In case you wondered, two compression fittings - one was barely finger tight and the other hopelessly squint and cross threaded.

Given that my folks used to do up houses for a living, I spent most of my youth surrounded by our local tradesmen and tended to be involved in all aspects from the age I was old enough to wield a hammer and screwdriver...so gas pipework etc isn't some great mystery. Nor is the importance of doing a proper job of fitting it, which I think is equally if not even more important.

Really do need to flush our central heating system and re-treat it with anti corrosion additive now I think about it...have given up trying to get an actual plumber in to do the job given the degree of "that's now worth me getting out of the van for" I came across when I tried...I might suggest that there's something wrong with their pricing structure then...
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by myglaren » 28 Nov 2017, 18:52

I have done quite a bit of gas work over the years, for myself, two of my daughters and for a company I used to work for.

I have hit a snag though - my youngest daughter has just bought a house and is in the process of moving in.
She has a second hand oven that needs connecting, a doddle thinks I having done loads previously.
However, this has a connector I haven't seen before.
IMGP1447.JPG
Sorry for the lousy photo, so little light the camera was refusing to focus.

This is on the cooker where I have always found a female connector in the past and available hoses all seem to have a male thread on them.

I'm sure I am missing something here. Was going to go to B&Q or similar and see what they actually had but thought it as well to ask here.

Any ideas?
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by RichardW » 29 Nov 2017, 09:08

Is that threaded, Steve? You might just need to screw an adapter on to it.
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Mandrake » 29 Nov 2017, 13:05

RichardW wrote:
27 Nov 2017, 14:01
As myglaren, no idea what the tank is for; it's got lots of internal pipeways and things, and at least 3 outlets off the bottom. There is some fouling inside, as Steve notes!
Mandrake wrote:which I'm not allowed to change myself since it would disturb gas lines
Actually, nothing to stop you doing that - the gas regs only require any one doing gas work to be 'competent' - it's only when you get into charging for the work that you need to be certified. Changing the fan on ours involves disconnecting the gas supply to the burner.... Am I competent :!:

Are you sure about that Richard ?

I'm a regular on a heating forum as well and a couple of the members are in the trade gas safe engineers and are pretty adamant that the regs do not allow someone who is not gas safe to carry out any work that requires breaking the seal of a gas part of the boiler, meaning disconnecting gas lines (gas leak risk if not correctly resealed) or opening the seal on the main fire box (CO leak risk) etc...

Like the rest of you, I'm pretty confident in my abilities to do the kind of work that experts say DIY'er shouldn't do, (it's never really stopped me before :lol: ) however what I lack is any sort of gas leak detector. So although I'm 99% sure I could disconnect and reconnect a gas line and seal it properly, without having a leak detector I would not feel comfortable doing this as I couldn't be certain that I had got it right - compression fittings can be funny old things, even with water, let alone gas! #-o

That one time you didn't quite get a good seal due to a poor olive or a scratched pipe could be a doozy - if water leaks out you can see it and tighten the joint a bit to fix it. A small amount of escaping gas into a closed boiler closet could go unnoticed - especially when you have as poor sense of smell as me! #-o

If you guys want to re-seal gas lines without a leak detector that's your choice I suppose. If I had a leak detector I think I would probably do the gas side as well, even though technically I shouldn't.

So for lack of a gas leak detector I don't touch the gas lines of my boiler, however I am willing to work on pretty much any other part of it. The plumbing side, wiring etc, no problem, and I replaced the gas control electrovalve as it is just a slide on unit, and also replaced and rewired the main power cable to it some time ago which was getting a big shabby... (As well as retrofitted an external digital flow temp thermostat)
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by Mandrake » 29 Nov 2017, 13:24

Zelandeth wrote:
26 Nov 2017, 13:06
This is exactly why the boiler we have here is going to be kept going until the bitter end. Everything in it is metal, and there are a total of five moving parts. The most complex electrical component is the thermostat. Four wires into it...L, N, E and a 240V "call for heat" signal. That's it. No fancy electronics, no timers, no purge systems, heck...no fan!
Sounds like our boiler, which must be about 25 years old I think. (Was already in the house when we moved in 3 years ago)

The previous owners didn't do any recent maintenance on the system (or the house for that matter! #-o ) so it was a bit of shambles when we moved in - mainly on the radiator side with old clogged up radiators, leaking radiator valves and no TRV's anywhere... Also the external pump was on it's last legs which I think I posted about here when I replaced the pump a couple of years ago.

All good on the pump front since then, still nice and quiet, and the only fault the boiler itself has had in the three years has been the gas control electrovalve coil sleeve went open circuit, which was easily replaced when I found someone willing to sell it separately from the main gas control unit!

Meanwhile in those 3 years the system has had a couple of drain and flushes, an automatic bypass valve fitted, a few old radiators replaced, smart TRV's fitted, (Honeywell Evohome) an external digital flow temperature thermostat, and last winter I converted it from gravity hot water to a fully controlled and pumped S-Plan system myself. That was a fun plumbing and wiring job which I quite enjoyed and boy did it make a difference to the hot water supply. :twisted:
Plus it's still B rated for efficiency even after 34 years.

Sadly ours is not. I looked it up and its not great... but it works, and touch wood seems pretty reliable. Replacing it would mean replacing all the ancient microbore piping around the house and probably half the radiators as well as it is currently gravity fed and I doubt some of the joints would hold up to being a sealed pressurised system... :lol: So for now I'm clinging to it and keeping it working as best I can...
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by RichardW » 29 Nov 2017, 13:35

Most gas fitters will not have read the regs, and will not have understood, or misheard what they were told, or they were not told correctly!

Link to the regs: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1998 ... tents/made

And the relevant section on competency:

Para 1 says competent, para 3, which refers to approved persons, only relates to employees / self employed persons.
Gas Safety Regs wrote:
Qualification and supervision

3.—(1) No person shall carry out any work in relation to a gas fitting or gas storage vessel unless he is competent to do so.

(2) The employer of any person carrying out such work for that employer, every other employer and self-employed person who has control to any extent of such work and every employer and self-employed person who has required such work to be carried out at any place of work under his control shall ensure that paragraph (1) above is complied with in relation to such work.

(3) Without prejudice to the generality of paragraphs (1) and (2) above and subject to paragraph (4) below, no employer shall allow any of his employees to carry out any work in relation to a gas fitting or service pipework and no self-employed person shall carry out any such work, unless the employer or self-employed person, as the case may be, is a member of a class of persons approved for the time being by the Health and Safety Executive for the purposes of this paragraph.

(4) The requirements of paragraph (3) above shall not apply in respect of—

(a)the replacement of a hose or regulator on a portable or mobile space heater; or
(b)the replacement of a hose connecting a re-fillable cylinder to installation pipework.
(5) An approval given pursuant to paragraph (3) above (and any withdrawal of such approval) shall be in writing and notice of it shall be given to such persons and in such manner as the Health and Safety Executive considers appropriate.

(6) The employer of any person carrying out any work in relation to a gas fitting or gas storage vessel in the course of his employment shall ensure that such of the following provisions of these Regulations as impose duties upon that person and are for the time being in force are complied with by that person.

(7) No person shall falsely pretend to be a member of a class of persons required to be approved under paragraph (3) above.

(8) Notwithstanding sub-paragraph (b) of regulation 2(4), when a person is carrying out work in premises referred to in that sub-paragraph in relation to a gas fitting in a vehicle, vessel or caravan—

(a)paragraphs (1), (2) and (6) of this regulation shall be complied with as respects thereto; and
(b)he shall ensure, so far as is reasonably practicable, that the installation of the gas fittings and flues will not contravene the provisions of these Regulations when the gas fittings are connected to a gas supply,
except that this paragraph shall not apply where the person has reasonable grounds for believing that the vehicle, vessel or caravan will be first used for a purpose which when so used will exclude it from the application of these Regulations by virtue of sub-paragraphs (a), (c) or (e) of regulation 2(5).
Obviously you are only going to do what you are comfortable with - I got a plumber out to reconnect the gas when we had the meter moved. He was seen to be smoking whilst doing the pressure test on the new pipework :roll:

Next time I have the fridge out, I'll take a photo of the gas pipe behind it, presumably modified by a 'qualified person' :rofl2:
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by RichardW » 29 Nov 2017, 13:37

Mandrake wrote:
29 Nov 2017, 13:24

Sadly ours is not. I looked it up and its not great... but it works, and touch wood seems pretty reliable. Replacing it would mean replacing all the ancient microbore piping around the house and probably half the radiators as well as it is currently gravity fed and I doubt some of the joints would hold up to being a sealed pressurised system... :lol: So for now I'm clinging to it and keeping it working as best I can...


You can still buy an open vented boiler (my Dad has just done that...and fitted it himself!) - the real problem you will run into is sorting out the condensate drain if the boiler is no where near an outside wall / internal drain routing. Of course if you speak to gas man, he will tell you to fit a combi.... :roll:
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by RichardW » 29 Nov 2017, 21:30

New fan fitted... we have ignition!
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Re: Confessions of a Citroholic

Post by myglaren » 29 Nov 2017, 21:35

RichardW wrote:
27 Nov 2017, 14:01
As myglaren, no idea what the tank is for; it's got lots of internal pipeways and things, and at least 3 outlets off the bottom. There is some fouling inside, as Steve notes!
Mandrake wrote:which I'm not allowed to change myself since it would disturb gas lines
Actually, nothing to stop you doing that - the gas regs only require any one doing gas work to be 'competent' - it's only when you get into charging for the work that you need to be certified. Changing the fan on ours involves disconnecting the gas supply to the burner.... Am I competent :!:

It isn't actually fouling as I presumed but an ion exchanger - uses the salt to soften the water.
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