Citrojim's Activa, 207 and Bike Tales

Tell us your ongoing tales and experiences with your French car here. Post pictures of your car here as well.

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Post by XantiaMan » 07 Jun 2009, 21:48

CitroJim wrote: work....

I shall miss my old 1.9TD. My first Xantia. I also do see why some prefer the 1.9TD over the 2.1TD. I have to say the 1.9TD does have a lot going for it and it's liviler than I ever recall...


You never did go out in my old TD Jim, you would have been quite surprised how a slightly tweaked one can perform. I miss it, an old faithful.
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Post by CitroJim » 20 Jun 2009, 21:08

It's been a bit of a while but I've been busy, both at work (nothing changed there :twisted: ), on the V6 and spending time with Val; the latter being very good time spent but it has somewhat kept me away from here :wink:

Apart from poor old Malcolm loosing a finger, the DSM Rally last weekend was a brilliant weekend :D I especially enjoyed Saturday's convoy. It was magical to witness so many DSs in convoy. Dave the rave and I were the back-markers along with Mick in his Traction Avant. Sadly, Mick broke down about three-quarters of the way to Wendover Wood and Dave and I stopped to offer assistance as the rest of the convoy went on ahead. Mick's problem was a heavy intermittent discharge, the reason we did not find the cause of until we returned to the rally site. The brake light switch operating rod had come loose and was intermittently shorting the power feed to the switch to earth.

Upshot was that I fell in love with the Traction and maybe one day one will become my next project :D For a 30s car they go very well and look so cool 8)

Today has been almost entirely spent on the V6 doing the final jobs before MOT. More on that in my V6 blog.

Sid The Squid visited me this afternoon in his LPG powered 1.8I Auto. He came for a gearbox oil change and to try and diagnose an engine running issue. The latter diid not meet with too much success just yet although some valuable clues were found. The former job went well and we used the Lexia to ensure the gearbox was at the right temperature when checking and adjusting the level of liquid gold in it. Suffice to say, as has been siad previously, it is very essential to have the AL4 at 60 degress when level checking and topping up.

The Activa and 2.1TD contine to perform faultlessly despite no maintenance recently. I took the Activa to the DSM and enjoyed the ride. I enjoyed it even more after it was used to demo DickieG's ELIT and the gathered hydractive ECU stored faults. Clearing them really does make a difference to the feel of the car; afterward it felt considerably tauter and more responsive on the handling side of things.

I do have a small problem with the Activa though. I discovered the passenger footwell was wet again. I noted this after our recent spell of hot weather when the aircon was heavily in use. On Sunday at the DSM rally I proved beyond doubt that aircon condensate is getting in the car. As soon as I have time in the week I'll be having an urgent look at that' foccussing attention on the plenum drain.

Next week I'm only working half-days. Such is the work I do nowadays that to be away for any stretch of time is impossible so in order to take some time off we've established a good old compromise of taking it as half days. Work is happy as they have me in the mornings and I'm happy as I have the afternoons to play cars!
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Post by Featch » 20 Jun 2009, 21:27

CitroJim wrote:It has been several months since I've driven the 1.9TD and I was very pleasantly surprised at what a fine car it still is. I'll be spending some time this week cleaning it up and giving it a full service ready for its new owner to collect on Friday.


And very pleased the new owner is too! I drove it back to Dudley to deliver it to son Vinnie's. A very pleasant sprightly car. More importantly it's had the approval of Vinnie's SWIMBO as well.
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Post by CitroJim » 20 Jun 2009, 21:33

Oh that's excellent Andy :D I've been wondering how Vinnie is getting on with her.
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Post by XantiaMan » 20 Jun 2009, 22:10

How many codes needing clearing on the Activa Jim? Mine needs the steering angle sensor doing again, its been a while.
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Post by Sl4yer » 21 Jun 2009, 00:29

XantiaMan583 wrote:How many codes needing clearing on the Activa Jim? Mine needs the steering angle sensor doing again, its been a while.


I cleared that once on mine, and it hasn't appeared again. Yet. But I suppose I've only had it for 7 months or so. What DOES reappear now and again is a 'Brake Pressure Sensor Intermittent Fault'. Not too worried about it, but trust it to be different!

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Post by CitroJim » 21 Jun 2009, 08:29

Sl4yer wrote:What DOES reappear now and again is a 'Brake Pressure Sensor Intermittent Fault'. Not too worried about it, but trust it to be different!


It will on a MK2 James as the brake pressure switch was deleted. It's a "ghost" fault :roll:

Mine had the usual "steering angle" fault Gareth and it crops up regularly and I've (and I think Richard has) seen it on EVERY Hydractive ECU I've diagnosed.

Richard's ELIT told me my steering wheel was out of action :shock: :lol:

James, I'm surprised you don't see regular occurrances of the steering angle fault. What's your secret?

Gareth, I'll be bringing my Lexia to the National. Can you wait until then? Else, if you're passing this way any time...
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Post by DickieG » 21 Jun 2009, 09:51

Sl4yer wrote:What DOES reappear now and again is a 'Brake Pressure Sensor Intermittent Fault'. Not too worried about it, but trust it to be different!

Check the date on your ecu as that fault showing up on a S2 would indicate that the ecu fitted is from a S1, as Jim mentions the brake pressure valve wasn't fitted to S2's so the original ecu would have been programmed accordingly.

The consequence of fitting a S1 ecu to a S2 is that once the car exceeds 16 mph the ecu switches into firm mode whilst it looks for the brake valve, after 5-10 minutes it gives up looking then works correctly albeit in a default state. Ultimately S1 and S2 Hydractive ecu's are not compatible.
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Post by XantiaMan » 21 Jun 2009, 09:59

CitroJim wrote:

Mine had the usual "steering angle" fault Gareth and it crops up regularly and I've (and I think Richard has) seen it on EVERY Hydractive ECU I've diagnosed.



Gareth, I'll be bringing my Lexia to the National. Can you wait until then? Else, if you're passing this way any time...


Yes mate can wait till then, or may pass by Richard's before then, got a mate doing a few more ding and dent removals from the Activa in prep for the show and it passes that way.

Don't forget my clutch in September?! :lol:
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Post by Sid_the_Squid » 21 Jun 2009, 13:30

Thanks for your help yesterday Jim, your excellent company, plus its nice to be able to change the box oil without a hideous configuration of jacks and spirit levels. As for the engine thing, I'm going to try cleaning or ordering a new MAP sensor, hopefully this will be the cause of the mixture errors, I'm incline to believe the occasional stalling on fan cut in may simply be a red herring.

Suffice to say, as has been said previously, it is very essential to have the AL4 at 60 degress when level checking and topping up.

It seems like there was quite a reasonable difference between box oil level between 55C and 65C, about 800cc.
However I now have doubts about the accuracy of the first level check, which of course would throw our whole conclusion out. I may not have measured the oil level accurately at the 55C mark, as when the engine is not running the oil level is higher, it tends to fill up the drain spout*, thus when you run the engine do the oil level check, it can at first seem correct, as the collected oil in the spout will run out. I did not let the oil run out long enough to be sure it was not simply 'spout collection' oil, therefore I don't think I was accurate enough with my 55C level test.
I would like to attempt the experiment again to be sure, as I put 2.5 liters of oil in (approx) just checked the manual now, it says 3 liters approx, so part of the large difference we experienced between the initial measurement at 55C and the final one at 65C might have been down to my error.

I hope that very soon Jim & I will be trying the same experiment on an 4HP20 box, this time I aim to make sure the conditions are more scientific.

Sorry for any confusion folks, my bad :oops:

*I cannot think of a word to describe the configuration of the drain plug in an AL4 box
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Post by CitroJim » 21 Jun 2009, 19:29

Sid_the_Squid wrote:*I cannot think of a word to describe the configuration of the drain plug in an AL4 box


I don't think there is a word. Basically, the drain plug has a smaller concentric plug in it that is the end of a tube that is about 2 inches long. This smaller plug is removed and if oil flows out it's above the top of this tube. Much like how a normal and reserve fuel supply works in a motorcycle fuel tank.

Looking forward to doing the 4HP20 :) I must recheck mine as I seem to have been topping it up now for an eternity :twisted:
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Post by Sl4yer » 21 Jun 2009, 22:05

CitroJim wrote:It will on a MK2 James as the brake pressure switch was deleted. It's a "ghost" fault :roll:

Mine had the usual "steering angle" fault Gareth and it crops up regularly and I've (and I think Richard has) seen it on EVERY Hydractive ECU I've diagnosed.


DickieG wrote:Check the date on your ecu as that fault showing up on a S2 would indicate that the ecu fitted is from a S1, as Jim mentions the brake pressure valve wasn't fitted to S2's so the original ecu would have been programmed accordingly.

The consequence of fitting a S1 ecu to a S2 is that once the car exceeds 16 mph the ecu switches into firm mode whilst it looks for the brake valve, after 5-10 minutes it gives up looking then works correctly albeit in a default state. Ultimately S1 and S2 Hydractive ecu's are not compatible.


Interesting chaps. I've had the Lexia out again tonight, in case I'd got the description drastically wrong. This is what I found:

Image

The ECU description page doesn't give any clues as to the version, but should it read Xantia II instead of just Xantia?

Image

I did notice that the brake pedal continued to be read as Pressed after I'd released it on some occasions. It takes a good press for the suspension ECU to record it as Pressed too, which makes sense (the ABS ECU sees it as pressed with the slightest pressure). So, how does a Mk 2 decide to go to FIRM mode due to the brake pedal???

Here's the Activa parameter screen for anyone interested:

Image

:D

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Post by DickieG » 21 Jun 2009, 22:22

The way to test it is to drive the car whilst observing the state of the suspension, the brake pressure sensor only switches under maximum braking so your screens don't really help.
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Post by Sl4yer » 21 Jun 2009, 22:38

DickieG wrote:The way to test it is to drive the car whilst observing the state of the suspension, the brake pressure sensor only switches under maximum braking so your screens don't really help.


I'm sure you're right. I'll do that at some point. But the questions remain - how does a Mk 2 decide to switch to hard under braking, and why does it sometimes remain as Pressed, but not every time?

I take it the ECU date is on a label somewhere on the casing? I'll have a look at it. I can't believe it would be the wrong one, but you never know...

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Post by CitroJim » 27 Jun 2009, 20:51

Sl4yer wrote: But the questions remain - how does a Mk 2 decide to switch to hard under braking, and why does it sometimes remain as Pressed, but not every time?


The ECU can calculate the braking force applied by measuring the rate of change of speed from the speed sensor during deceleration and to a lesser extent, the amount of dive as measured by the yew sensor on the front ARB. The second question, I'd hazard the input to the ECU is open-circuit as there is no sensor present and it may therefore "Float" to a random value.If the ECU is a MK2 one it will disregard it anyway or else assume the sensor is faulty and disregard it.

What news of my fleet? Well, as my V6 is now on the road, she'll henceforth be reported on in this blog. She passd her MOT on Monday and has been in constant use since, the Activa and 2.1TD have not been touched...

The V6 has been good this past week so this morning we took the bull by the horns, bit the bullet and took her on her first long journey to Somerset and back, a good round-trip of over 300 miles. She went a treat and never missed a beat. She aso returned 36MPG on the run but admittedly that was with still rather careful driving and not exceeding 70MPH and having the gearbox running with it's economy map. There was one occasion when I needed to get past a slower moving vehicle quickly and she did her double down-shift trick and flew past :lol:

It was interesting to feel the gearbox switching between it's maps on the journey, going from the economy upwards toward the sportier maps as conditions dicated. Impressive.

The V6 with it's hydractive suspension and very quiet engine makes a lovely relaxed, long-legged cruiser perfect for long fast trips :D Shes' very comfy and handles well but she's not on a par with the Activa in that department. Driving a V6 is akin to driving a drawing room on wheels with comfy old leather armchairs :D I love it...

We had a look at Dad's new Nissan Pixo today. Not bad as a city car but oh gosh, after a V6 it seemed to have no suspension on it at all and the seats are rock-hard. I took Dad out in it and the feeling was that of bouncing up the road, almost like a cork in a rough sea. It's a perky little performer but the engine, being a three cylinder, is a little rough and uncivilised. I took Dad out in the V6 over the same route and all the bumps that so upset the Pixo were non-existent. Still, it's not a fair comparason is it really? A V6 against a Pixo!

Dad has a problem with it. He's very deaf and the engine is so quiet he cannot hear it when it's idling. Nor can I very well but I could feel it vibrating on its mounts at idle rather than actually hearing it.

Against that, it's a well screwed-together little motor and overall, I was pretty well impressed with it. Not bad for something made in Mumbai! It goes round corners well but given it's very hard suspension, it's not really surprising.
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